From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [NonGNU ELPA] New package: llm Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2023 22:02:26 -0400 Message-ID: References: <54c21d90-8bd6-8723-9e33-d69179b37bd0@gmail.com> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="15793"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: ahyatt@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Jim Porter Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 17 04:02:54 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qWSLd-0003sw-Uh for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 17 Aug 2023 04:02:54 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qWSLF-0001rc-12; Wed, 16 Aug 2023 22:02:29 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qWSLC-0001r6-Tr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Aug 2023 22:02:26 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qWSLC-0005HS-L6; Wed, 16 Aug 2023 22:02:26 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=bJG1yzghI3jOvulYEFYTqmvDmlYSavObUkFJsIwNWK8=; b=K3eCkfswDU/b J1lCexcQO6k/GZiO3BSc76bObhWZMjFtF7OJ1/MxmAGz/U1ckBECl4ZOlsUv1p0NdGZXTEbOrKujy Pez42wbRPV8Ywzp/mUJ+tHHBAOxNGnm+a2G2BP2SM1l/5L15vm+J7ksfY0QBq4NmR5dHVdnDZFe4G /8cjhR/I9t+/4srOtEnP7N1w/vGpF8aH3OB2s3eJfHqCZ/as47gb1u7nxZnJ2Pjua3572HI7gZD1D CcfDChSklyVYmz19FpA42Wi1+lsrTMkloDbzJxCiixnCWbw3Xj180qxk3baaxlAiEh2unUsakCikB FT9jVLRiGZUSQHaWU+NEbw==; Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qWSLC-0005qF-AV; Wed, 16 Aug 2023 22:02:26 -0400 In-Reply-To: <54c21d90-8bd6-8723-9e33-d69179b37bd0@gmail.com> (message from Jim Porter on Tue, 15 Aug 2023 10:12:20 -0700) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:308842 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > Among other things, I'm curious about what the FSF would say > about the *models* the LLMs use. Are they "just data", or should we > treat them more like object code? What does an LLM that fully adheres to > FSF principles actually look like? I've been thinking about this, and my tentative conclusion is that that precise question is not crucial, because what is certain is that they are part of the control over the system's behavior. So they ought to be released under a free license. In the examples I've heard of, that is never the case. Either they are secret -- users can only use them on a server, which is SaaSS, see https://gnu.org/philosophy/who-does-that-server-really-serve.html -- or they are released under nonfree licenses that restrict freedom 0; see https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/programs-must-not-limit-freedom-to-run.html. As I recall, we don't have a rule against features to interface servers whose code is not released, and we certainly don't have a rule against code in Emacs to interact with nonfree software _provided said software is well known_ -- that is why it is ok to have code to interact with Windows and Android. ISTR we have features in Emacs for talking to servers whose code is not release. But does anyone recall better than I do? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)