From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] new package: tramp-docker Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 08:06:30 -0400 Message-ID: References: <874jw4l678.fsf@gmail.com> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="23114"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Payas Relekar Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Oct 18 14:47:21 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1okm08-0005l3-3S for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 18 Oct 2022 14:47:20 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:34698 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1okm06-00072y-Pb for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 18 Oct 2022 08:47:18 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41420) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oklMf-0004ZT-9B for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 18 Oct 2022 08:06:33 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:51348) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oklMd-0005gj-Li; Tue, 18 Oct 2022 08:06:31 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=x+rkUPFJQ3kanZr1SLaC05+lo+FxfYMhwrD5lPNsv9Q=; b=ilDtNXQvchpD SX2Xrc20S+/dXTAMChX99unaq/WuMbZMs/PDi8pTAP7agAA+QWBYwhCmCjUlR8ZTOdmWwEMe+xZGQ lzmXt1O1CKCBoVXiqLymgxVscQDW0/3BwSdDc3poyxnOMVN4To5UpudLXG6fDPkOkmbRnQMSx+2cw jALfn0tSCxGeSUrb+RVl+o7wWHHhjVsObZ6lNzrXmfowz4IXQ6AkbennC/cU7s2yHIypZrM+h3x2Y qc3nmtbcUQU6if/BLFQJwUjXSUFgEypQ9dkec7C6em8LoI0TB0dB8XTLbq8/jV6iVTlkPsWtGL97j YXOBWUrIeEhYblhY4klB9A==; Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oklMc-0003Mn-7c; Tue, 18 Oct 2022 08:06:30 -0400 In-Reply-To: <874jw4l678.fsf@gmail.com> (message from Payas Relekar on Sun, 16 Oct 2022 10:16:14 +0530) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:298038 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > Docker is a platform that provides few services: > 1. A uniform container format (Now separated into OCI standard) > 2. A way to build and run these containers (docker daemon) ... > Out of these, #1 is already standardised and fully open. > #2 is not exclusive to docker, and there are multiple ways to acheive > this thanks to #1 being open. Sad to say, that doesn't mean that #2 is no problem for software freedom. Rather, it means that some methods are a problem and others are not. I can't be certain with my current partial knowledge, but I think that the methods which are a problem are a very grave problem, and we need to speak to the community about avoiding them. I think we need to identify any frequently used methods for building Docker containers that makes it easy to fail to think about whether the contents are free. > 3. A global (and optionally local) container registry (akin to apt-get) > #3 is where things start getting fuzzy as docker the platform does not > provide any way to ensure containers only include free software. That > being said, as mentioned earlier, docker itself is not necessary to > build these containers. I think this is a crucial part of the reason why some ways of building docker containers are a grave problem. Would you disagree? > As such, the name docker only signifies what has become de-facto calling > convention for OCI containers, but otherwise as long as we avoid linking > to docker the service, we are in the clear. That seems plausible to me. emacs-devel is not the right place to have the discssion about building containers. I should launch it in some other place or way. Do you know enough about containers to help in that discussion? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)