From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] new package: tramp-docker Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2022 18:03:58 -0400 Message-ID: References: <5674f36a-c276-fd77-b4d2-1525c75a1602@spork.org> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1006"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Robin Tarsiger Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Oct 07 00:06:40 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1ogZ0p-000AbE-6t for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 07 Oct 2022 00:06:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48212 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogZ0n-0002eV-PP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 06 Oct 2022 18:06:37 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53924) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogYyH-00018e-5r for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 06 Oct 2022 18:04:01 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:51278) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogYyG-0002MF-Sn; Thu, 06 Oct 2022 18:04:00 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=SAlcczagGzueEZDhMDknVmOiZobQpyJ3cnqOyscVw8s=; b=RAFVNAm9+QtX SPAJSJblOfuC2xXoZ0GaM8uEDzJanGAgNYWDxJDWaOKisNIC0BUDXVZXap9bQhjGJvvCE8vKAJoZh nk2lVjHFPLLAetjM6cm+RDpBPYAmb3+Fu9pIKGTC8OXpGVogVP0b223OC9JW4Od5pKbVQl/9YvNOY /Wo4HgjT1DCf0U1X3q0w6L0Y9dswjfsPyIze9GwpsqaXrzFO0QbTR8tfw3tGMGgJ78ArL2JA1Jrbs pr7VBSgmgWsP9AcW8+BJ43SuKS0XMYEi1RItP5u2z+Ddp6XomABlZcilvAKlSHaOsB+k9IrxEZFws W9O7yzZwi+7oXtdQCcirWA==; Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogYyE-0001fZ-H5; Thu, 06 Oct 2022 18:03:59 -0400 In-Reply-To: (message from Robin Tarsiger on Sat, 24 Sep 2022 00:53:21 -0500) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:297126 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > This code is used to access files in Docker or Podman containers that are > running on the same system as Emacs. It calls the Docker or Podman program > to spawn a shell inside the container to communicate with. It is similar > to the su or sudo Tramp methods, in that the connection to the "remote" > system involves shared kernel resources (unless Docker or Podman itself > eventually chooses to do something else). Thanks for explaining. My overload is such that I just saw this today -- because I recalled I hadn't seen a reply and decided to search for it. Now I understand what this is does, and it will be a convenient feature. But it raises a couple of possible moral issues. 1. Is the Docker program free software? Is the Podman program free software? If neither of them is free software, is this a feature that promotes running nonfree software on GNU? 2. Supposing that one of them is free software, and there is no problem of that kind, there's another problem that people have reported to me: in making a container, there is a risk of including nonfree programs and you can't easily tell if that has happened, let alone make sure it won't happen. The container-making process tends to pull in dependencies without checking whether they are free. That is not a reason to refuse to support this access-into-containers feature, but we should take advantage of this feature and its documentation to inform people about that problem. 3. Distributing free programs in containers tends to be bad for the community's control over the program. Because people don't build the program on the GNU/Linux distros they use, and don't package it for those distros. This too we should use the opportunity to warn people about. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)