From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: GNU Emacs raison d'etre Date: Thu, 14 May 2020 23:16:48 -0400 Message-ID: References: <5230692c-c665-a330-7a12-e59fa25d97dd@gmail.com> <70bb51fd-447d-928c-4d69-1c9673a44471@online.de> <871rnnvmdx.fsf@red-bean.com> <87pnb7sira.fsf@red-bean.com> <06bcddd4-6991-e4f7-e944-93de14af263d@yandex.ru> <87h7wjsd8o.fsf@red-bean.com> <20897f01-122d-7f91-eac2-70f5ad75796f@yandex.ru> <87d077qfmm.fsf@red-bean.com> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="68198"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, andreas.roehler@online.de, dgutov@yandex.ru To: Karl Fogel Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri May 15 05:17:52 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jZQrA-000Hci-8V for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 15 May 2020 05:17:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:33382 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZQr9-0005q0-8G for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 14 May 2020 23:17:51 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45628) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZQqA-0004UI-D6 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 14 May 2020 23:16:50 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:49308) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZQq9-0006ys-3n; Thu, 14 May 2020 23:16:49 -0400 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jZQq8-0007tR-95; Thu, 14 May 2020 23:16:48 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87d077qfmm.fsf@red-bean.com> (message from Karl Fogel on Wed, 13 May 2020 23:56:01 -0500) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:250314 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > * Tell newcomers up front that Emacs really starts to be worth it > * after a few years, not a few weeks. I don't believe that is true. It is an exaggeration. > * Show them some of the abilities they will eventually have, so > * that they can see why it's worth it to make the investment. That is useful. > * Also tell them about the ways in which Emacs may frustrate them > * along the way, and explain that those frustrations are common > * and are sometimes inevitably entangled with the same things that > * make Emacs winning in the long term. This sounds like a recipe for discouraging people from starting. > I've watched newcomers run into the same obstacles over and > over, and this particular obstacle is always one of the first > they encounter. Which obstacle is that? If we can identify specific things that are likely to frustrate users, we can work on improving them. But I can't see in your message what that refers to. -- Dr Richard Stallman Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)