From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: POP3 password in plaintext? Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:54:03 -0400 Message-ID: References: <878ul1x4kw.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87ppecv3pj.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87sij8ical.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1412168130 25234 80.91.229.3 (1 Oct 2014 12:55:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2014 12:55:30 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: David Kastrup Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 01 14:55:24 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XZJRD-0007aw-II for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 14:55:23 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55251 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XZJRD-0001O7-9W for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:55:23 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:55904) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XZJPz-00086y-Tr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:54:08 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XZJPw-0007pv-2K for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:54:07 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:56493) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XZJPw-0007pr-0B for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:54:04 -0400 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XZJPv-0003OC-23; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:54:03 -0400 In-reply-to: <87sij8ical.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> (message from David Kastrup on Wed, 01 Oct 2014 07:33:54 +0200) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:174902 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] Transparent STARTTLS on demand would seem useless against man-in-the-middle attacks. It's just good against eavesdropping on unintercepted traffic. And you don't even need to be true man-in-the-middle: you just need to be faster answering the STARTTLS negotiation. Are other protocols for fetching mail better in security? David Caldwell wrote: Modern POP/IMAP clients tend to have a checkbox or a setting to require SSL/TLS when connecting. If the protocol doesn't start TLS (and isn't connected to an SSL port) then it is considered a connection error. This setting is configured up-front, at the same time that the user configures the server name and port. In this day and age it might make sense to have such a checkbox default to "on". That makes sense -- if STARTTLS in POP3 is fundamentally adequate. But if Kastrup is right, that isn't so. -- Dr Richard Stallman President, Free Software Foundation 51 Franklin St Boston MA 02110 USA www.fsf.org www.gnu.org Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software. Use Ekiga or an ordinary phone call.