develop an emacs library

develop an emacs library

[Ivan Kanis]

Hello,

It would be a good thing to have emacs as a library.

It could be used for Android development. I would compile the .so with
the NDK. Prototype my program with my desktop emacs. Then I would dump
the thing in the device. The fun part would be to have a REPL to do
iterative development.

Also if there is such a library, one could write an emacs GUI with Java
so that we could run emacs proper on Android.

Am I nut?
-- 
Thieves respect property. They merely wish the property to become
their property that they may more properly respect it.
    -- G. K. Chesterton

I am listening to "Blind Faith - Sea Of Joy".

Re: develop an emacs library

[Jambunathan K]

Ivan Kanis <banana@kanis.fr> writes:

> Hello,
>
> It would be a good thing to have emacs as a library.
>
> It could be used for Android development. I would compile the .so with
> the NDK. Prototype my program with my desktop emacs. Then I would dump
> the thing in the device. The fun part would be to have a REPL to do
> iterative development.
>
> Also if there is such a library, one could write an emacs GUI with Java
> so that we could run emacs proper on Android.

> Am I nut?

(I could be off the mark with this reply.)

I remember the mono runtime (Runtime for C# code) having similar
facility.  

See
        http://www.mono-project.com/Guide:Running_Mono_Applications

I see parallels to

1. emacs --batch

2. We can make the .elc byte code files a non-native binary.  .exe files
   are but CLI byte-code files.

3. mkbundle

   This seems like bundling the required .el(c) libraries and stripping
   all other unused libraries.
-- 

Re: develop an emacs library

[joakim]

Ivan Kanis <banana@kanis.fr> writes:

> Hello,
>
> It would be a good thing to have emacs as a library.
>
> It could be used for Android development. I would compile the .so with
> the NDK. Prototype my program with my desktop emacs. Then I would dump
> the thing in the device. The fun part would be to have a REPL to do
> iterative development.
>
> Also if there is such a library, one could write an emacs GUI with Java
> so that we could run emacs proper on Android.
>
> Am I nut?

This isnt what you were asking, but did you have a look at GNU Guile?
It is indeed a library that implements Scheme, that you can link to your
application. I have done this in some projects, but not on Android.

As a more on-topic answer, there are Android ports of emacs. I think
they more or less run in a terminal on Android. 

-- 
Joakim Verona

Re: develop an emacs library, Re: develop an emacs library

[Ivan Kanis]

March, 14 at 21:19 joakim@verona.se wrote:

> This isnt what you were asking, but did you have a look at GNU Guile?

March, 14 at 18:30 Richard wrote:

> If you want a REPL in a program, how about using Guile,
> which is intended for that?

Because I prefer to program in elisp rather than learning Guile.
-- 
The recent proliferation of Nuclear Testing.
    -- BOFH excuse #40

Re: develop an emacs library, Re: develop an emacs library

[Jay Belanger]

Ivan Kanis <banana@kanis.fr> writes:
...
>> If you want a REPL in a program, how about using Guile,
>> which is intended for that?
>
> Because I prefer to program in elisp rather than learning Guile.

I thought Guile had pretty good support for elisp.

Re: develop an emacs library, Re: develop an emacs library

[Ivan Kanis]

Le 14 Mars à 23h31, Jay Belanger a écrit :

> Ivan Kanis <banana@kanis.fr> writes:
> ...
>>> If you want a REPL in a program, how about using Guile,
>>> which is intended for that?
>>
>> Because I prefer to program in elisp rather than learning Guile.
>
> I thought Guile had pretty good support for elisp.

I don't need the VM.
-- 
L'homme le plus heureux est celui qui fait le bonheur d'un plus grand
nombre d'autres.
    -- Denis Diderot

Re: develop an emacs library

[Richard Stallman]

    It would be a good thing to have emacs as a library.

This might create vulnerabilities to sneaking around the GPL,
so please don't.

If you want a REPL in a program, how about using Guile,
which is intended for that?

-- 
Dr Richard Stallman
President, Free Software Foundation
51 Franklin St
Boston MA 02110
USA
www.fsf.org  www.gnu.org
Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software.
  Use Ekiga or an ordinary phone call

Re: develop an emacs library

[Ivan Kanis]

March, 14 at 18:30 Richard wrote:

> This might create vulnerabilities to sneaking around the GPL,
> so please don't.

I understand your concern. 

However I have worked making proprietary software (I know, I know, one
has to make a living) for many years now. For the last 15 years I have
been told not to use GPL including LGPL libraries.

Why do you think a commercial company would use a elisp library? Every
commercial programmers I know write in C++, Java or C# these days. They
are too busy to try anything else.

Should we limit ourselves (here I include myself as a hobby free
developer) in fear that a company would use it?

It is easy to shoot and idea and I feel your stance is unfair.
-- 
For every person who wants to teach there are approximately thirty who
don't want to learn - much.
    -- W.C. Sellar and R.J. Yeatman

Re: develop an emacs library

[Richard Stallman]

    However I have worked making proprietary software (I know, I know, one
    has to make a living) for many years now. For the last 15 years I have
    been told not to use GPL including LGPL libraries.

That is true in ordinary companies, but ordinary companies
are not what I'm worried about.

    Why do you think a commercial company would use a elisp library? 

To make a nonfree extended version of Emacs, perhaps.

-- 
Dr Richard Stallman
President, Free Software Foundation
51 Franklin St
Boston MA 02110
USA
www.fsf.org  www.gnu.org
Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software.
  Use Ekiga or an ordinary phone call

Re: develop an emacs library

[Ivan Kanis]

March, 16 at 20:02 Richard wrote:

>     Why do you think a commercial company would use a elisp library? 
>
> To make a nonfree extended version of Emacs, perhaps.

Emacs users are a minority. At my company we are less than 5%. I think
you are worrying for things that won't happen. Anyway it was just an
idea that I don't have time to implement so you needn't worry.

Take care,
-- 
Somebody ran the operating system through a spelling checker.
    -- BOFH excuse #29

Re: develop an emacs library

[Søren Pilgård]

On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Ivan Kanis <banana@kanis.fr> wrote:
> March, 16 at 20:02 Richard wrote:
>
>>     Why do you think a commercial company would use a elisp library?
>>
>> To make a nonfree extended version of Emacs, perhaps.
>
> Emacs users are a minority. At my company we are less than 5%. I think
> you are worrying for things that won't happen. Anyway it was just an
> idea that I don't have time to implement so you needn't worry.
>

I think the fear here is for situations like this:
Some small company sees how popular new editors like lighttable and
sublimetext is. Wanting to cash in on this easily they make a shiny
interface relying on this "emacs library" for doing the base work.

GPL ensures people don't just download the source code and do this,
but it is unclear whether providing this "emacs library" could open a
way to circumvent this.