From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bidi,gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Handling invisible text in bidirectional display Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:03 -0500 Message-ID: References: <83y6jyat25.fsf@gnu.org> <87eilpzwrs.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <83vdf1bxbg.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1263744349 11420 80.91.229.12 (17 Jan 2010 16:05:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 16:05:49 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-bidi@gnu.org, dak@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-bidi-bounces+gnu-emacs-bidi=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Jan 17 17:05:41 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: gnu-emacs-bidi@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NWXdC-0007UL-Fb for gnu-emacs-bidi@m.gmane.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 17:05:38 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60758 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NWXdD-0003D2-Et for gnu-emacs-bidi@m.gmane.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:39 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NWXcj-0002np-RK for emacs-bidi@gnu.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:09 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NWXce-0002k8-VC for emacs-bidi@gnu.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:09 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=56182 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NWXce-0002jt-Q1; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:04 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:46088) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NWXcd-0000ZL-Ta; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:04 -0500 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NWXcd-0005Sg-Mj; Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:05:03 -0500 In-reply-to: <83vdf1bxbg.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Sat, 16 Jan 2010 22:37:39 +0200) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-bidi@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of Emacs support for multi-directional text." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-bidi-bounces+gnu-emacs-bidi=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-bidi-bounces+gnu-emacs-bidi=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bidi:444 gmane.emacs.devel:120163 Archived-At: Your description of the interaction of invisible with bidi seems right to me, but I was surprised by your response to this > I think a reasonable model is to display the text as if the invisible > characters are not there. I think the resulting change of the visual order will surprise the users. It also complicates implementation, which for me is an important downside. because I don't see a differnce between "display the text as if the invisible characters are not there" and what you described (in the no-ellipsis case). What you described One consequence is that a run of invisible characters can now be split into several non-contiguous runs. For example, this text: abcABCxyz with c and A covered by an invisible property will be displayed as abCBxyz seems to agree entirely with that description. Is there something I have misunderstood? However, the invisible characters do have some effect when they generate an ellipsis. In that case, multiple ellipses as you've described seems right.