From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Autoload from a web page? Date: Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:23:50 -0500 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: rms@gnu.org NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1262622332 23379 80.91.229.12 (4 Jan 2010 16:25:32 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 16:25:32 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Lennart Borgman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jan 04 17:25:20 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NRpk7-0004MT-G9 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 17:25:19 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53904 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NRpk7-0004Cy-RW for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:25:19 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NRpj7-0002dm-Ur for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:24:18 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NRpj1-0002Uu-PO for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:24:15 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=58982 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NRpj1-0002UO-II for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:24:11 -0500 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.10] (port=56197 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NRpj1-00012g-13 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:24:11 -0500 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NRpig-0004pt-H8; Mon, 04 Jan 2010 11:23:50 -0500 In-reply-to: (message from Lennart Borgman on Mon, 4 Jan 2010 03:26:45 +0100) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:119372 Archived-At: I have added an optional pause in the download where the user may check the file before it is byte compiled and used. That is rather vague, so I don't know exactly what you mean. Judging from what you've said, a "chance to check the file" is insufficient to make it easy for users to install and run edited versions. So this autoloading is still harmful. Some people argued that downloading files as you need them is not useful. I think it can be. If something like this was used for ELPA The idea of an ELPA is just theoretical at this point, but if we have one, "autoloading from the net" won't be allowed in it unless you convince me to approve it. You won't convince me unless you show me you understand and care about the issue I am concerned about. then different people could depend on each others files. If that is desirable technically (which is far from clear; it could be unmodular), there are other ways to do it. Packages in Debian depend on other packages and they don't autoload from the net. But even if it turned out that autoloading gave some advantage, that isn't a major factor in a decision this important. A minor convenience is insignificant compared with the community harm that this could do. You are trying to rush us into a major policy change which is potentially dangerous. We will not be rushed. Please slow down! Please take this change out of your distribution sources, pause for a week, and then post a clear explanation of what you are proposing now, so that I can have a chance to see what its consequences could be.