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From: Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org>
Cc: abraham@dina.kvl.dk, lennart.borgman.073@student.lu.se,
	emacs-devel@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, storm@cua.dk,
	snogglethorpe@gmail.com, drew.adams@oracle.com, miles@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 04:44:26 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <E1D2RA2-0002u4-4l@fencepost.gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <200502181412.j1IECkj14736@raven.dms.auburn.edu> (message from Luc Teirlinck on Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:46 -0600 (CST))

    But the problem is exactly that he may _not_ be satisfied with all the
    current "settings" (widget values).  He may just have wanted to set
    them, or even more likely, just has been looking at them.

The arguments you are making are arguments for complexity.  That is
the wrong approach for designing a user interface to help beginners.
So please stop raising such arguments.

We need to design a simple interface that is easy for beginners to
understand, so that they are not afraid to use it.  This means
rejecting the goal that it should be able to do "whatever the user
might want to do".  We have to design it to do the most common things
in the most straightforward way.

So please stop making arguments about "but maybe the user only wants X".

      Other
    interfaces are not trying to handle an underlying customization system
    that is anywhere as complex and extensive as Emacs'.

This is no excuse for making it more complex than it has to be,
so please don't mention it.

							  The average
    Custom buffer is a lot longer and contains a lot more options than the
    average customization "page" (or whatever they call it).

If that is a real cause of difficulty, lets subdivide the groups more.

      The choices
    you have for an individual option can be a lot more complex.  Complex
    types like `choice' force a concept of a `widget' value.

What do you mean by a "widget" value?

  parent reply	other threads:[~2005-02-19  9:44 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 148+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <DNEMKBNJBGPAOPIJOOICKENMCAAA.drew.adams@oracle.com>
2005-01-31  0:20 ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should ask forconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-01-31  1:07   ` Stefan Monnier
2005-01-31  2:02     ` Miles Bader
2005-01-31  1:16   ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should askforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-01-31  1:55     ` Miles Bader
2005-01-31  2:06     ` Drew Adams
2005-01-31 15:21     ` Per Abrahamsen
2005-01-31 17:22       ` Drew Adams
2005-01-31 21:39         ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-01-31 22:37           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file shouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-01-31 22:59           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should askforconfirmation Kim F. Storm
2005-01-31 23:50             ` Stefan Monnier
2005-02-01  0:44               ` Simon Josefsson
2005-01-31 23:56             ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-01  8:56               ` Per Abrahamsen
2005-02-01 14:11                 ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-01 16:21                   ` Drew Adams
2005-02-02  7:27         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-02 18:01           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file shouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-02 18:46             ` Stefan Monnier
2005-02-02 19:02               ` Drew Adams
2005-02-03  2:43                 ` Miles Bader
2005-02-03  6:58                   ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03  7:39                     ` Miles Bader
2005-02-03  9:36                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-03 14:46                         ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 15:18                           ` David Kastrup
2005-02-03 15:30                             ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 19:30                         ` Drew Adams
2005-02-03 19:54                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 20:05                             ` Drew Adams
2005-02-03 20:13                               ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 20:18                                 ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-03 20:23                                   ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-04 10:22                             ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Kim F. Storm
2005-02-07  5:32                               ` Drew Adams
2005-02-07  7:25                                 ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-07  7:34                                   ` Drew Adams
2005-02-07 17:28                                     ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-07 20:23                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 20:26                                       ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-08 11:46                                         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-07 13:45                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 16:46                                     ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-07 14:15                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 16:23                                     ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-07 20:22                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 20:29                                         ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-08 11:46                                           ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-09  8:11                                     ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-09 13:29                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 15:07                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfiles Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 15:53                                     ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-09  8:11                                 ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-09 13:31                                   ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-09 17:27                                     ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-09 20:31                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-09 21:27                                         ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-10 14:42                                           ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-10 15:20                                             ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-11 21:12                                             ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-09 14:12                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-09 17:17                                     ` Drew Adams
2005-02-10 18:39                                     ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-10 21:56                                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-11 21:13                                         ` Drew Adams
2005-02-12 14:27                                           ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-12 18:04                                             ` Drew Adams
2005-02-12 18:45                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 21:01                                                 ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-12 21:21                                                   ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 21:28                                                     ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-12 21:42                                                       ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-13  0:17                                                         ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-13  0:54                                                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-13  4:13                                                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-14  2:25                                                             ` Customize buttons thatchangeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-13  4:32                                                           ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-14  2:07                                                 ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-14  2:21                                                   ` Drew Adams
2005-02-14  3:32                                                   ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 19:03                                               ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 19:21                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 20:09                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12  8:37                                         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-12  9:14                                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-12 11:48                                           ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-12 14:58                                             ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-07 20:51                           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-08 20:37                             ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-15  6:18                         ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-15  7:05                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-16  9:32                             ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-16 13:07                               ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-16 14:44                                 ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-16 17:14                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-16 23:07                                     ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-15 17:51                           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-15 18:33                             ` Drew Adams
2005-02-15 19:14                               ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-15 19:51                                 ` Drew Adams
2005-02-16  7:25                                   ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-17 10:34                             ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-15 23:20                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-16  0:03                             ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-16  0:56                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-17 10:35                             ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-17 12:44                               ` Kim F. Storm
     [not found]                                 ` <003e01c51506$35ecb6e0$0200a8c0@sedrcw11488>
     [not found]                                   ` <m3oeejyxd6.fsf@kfs-l.imdomain.dk>
2005-02-17 17:27                                     ` David Kastrup
2005-02-17 18:32                                     ` Drew Adams
2005-02-17 20:33                                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-17 23:06                                         ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-17 22:57                                 ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18  8:23                                   ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-18 13:54                                     ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-18 14:12                                     ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18 14:56                                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-18 22:59                                         ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18 23:29                                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18 23:45                                             ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-19  1:16                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  1:28                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  3:10                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19 21:32                                                 ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-19 20:55                                           ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-19 21:24                                           ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-20  2:31                                             ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19 20:54                                         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-20  8:52                                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-20 17:09                                             ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-20 19:24                                               ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-20 20:18                                                 ` David Kastrup
2005-02-20 20:46                                                   ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-21  1:00                                                 ` Drew Adams
2005-02-20 17:17                                             ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  9:44                                       ` Richard Stallman [this message]
2005-02-19 15:42                                         ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  9:44                                     ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-17 18:34                               ` Drew Adams
2005-02-18 14:13                                 ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-18 15:17                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-19  3:51                                     ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-16  0:37                           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-17 10:35                             ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-03 19:13                 ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file shouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-01 13:30     ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should askforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-01-31  1:22   ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should ask forconfirmation Miles Bader
2005-02-01 13:30     ` Richard Stallman

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