From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: customize-apropos Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 19:20:19 -0800 Message-ID: References: <200512140213.jBE2Dxu17342@raven.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1134530539 28012 80.91.229.2 (14 Dec 2005 03:22:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 03:22:19 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Dec 14 04:22:07 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from [199.232.75.2] (helo=lists.gnu.org) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EmNC6-000234-Hn for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 04:20:42 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EmNCf-0001vH-TZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 22:21:17 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1EmNCR-0001uy-Mm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 22:21:03 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1EmNCQ-0001uF-6b for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 22:21:03 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EmNCQ-0001u8-3e for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 22:21:02 -0500 Original-Received: from [148.87.122.30] (helo=rgminet01.oracle.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA:24) (Exim 4.34) id 1EmNEQ-0008HV-2A for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 22:23:06 -0500 Original-Received: from rgmsgw300.us.oracle.com (rgmsgw300.us.oracle.com [138.1.186.49]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.1.6/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id jBE3KMHo007649 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 20:20:23 -0700 Original-Received: from rgmsgw300.us.oracle.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rgmsgw300.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.1.7/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id jBE3KMXl006367 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 20:20:22 -0700 Original-Received: from dradamslap (dhcp-amer-rmdc-csvpn-gw5-141-144-106-118.vpn.oracle.com [141.144.106.118]) by rgmsgw300.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.1.7/Switch-3.1.7) with SMTP id jBE3KLgd006354 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 13 Dec 2005 20:20:22 -0700 Original-To: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <200512140213.jBE2Dxu17342@raven.dms.auburn.edu> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org X-Broken-Reverse-DNS: no host name found for IP address 199.232.75.2 Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:47667 Archived-At: I probably shouldn't jump in here, but that text tells me nothing, except to stay away from the option in question. That is what it tells you _if_ you do not know what you are doing. What else do you believe people should be doing if they did not _deliberately_ want to override the usual Custom safeguards, but got to see these options by accident (presumably through a bug)? If this is truly dangerous, then we shouldn't show it. By default, we do not show it. If this is truly dangerous, then we shouldn't show it. It is not necessarily dangerous if you know what you are doing. This message is shown if someone does `C-u M-x customize-apropos' - that's what we're discussing, right? So, you're saying that someone who does that either must "know what he is doing" and not need and not want to know how to change the options he explicitly asked to see, or he doesn't "know what he is doing" and so should be scared away. Is that a fair characterization of your position? To me, it is reasonable in that context to remind people that they can use M-x set-variable to change a non-defcustom user option. I wouldn't even want to scare people for internal variables; I'd just tell them that the variable is not intended to be changed by users. That may be what you intended, but the language you used is too strong for that purpose. Reminding people how to change a non-defcustom user option and reminding them not to change internal variables is more useful than just telling them "use only if you know what you are doing". Besides, this is not about _using_ the variable ("use only if"); it is about changing its value.