From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ergus Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [PATCH] Project out of sources compilation Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2024 11:59:29 +0200 Message-ID: References: <21f05c6124d1281dcec22404d788330abe1e55c0.camel@yandex.ru> <86v84y8yaj.fsf@gnu.org> <122ab8a44f7c4eacd480975246d66ef3a1060d38.camel@yandex.ru> <86sf028rjo.fsf@gnu.org> <86r0fm8n3j.fsf@gnu.org> <21199757e8643ad0f4924b442c0371ae24afe84e.camel@yandex.ru> <86jzle8fx5.fsf@gnu.org> <99b6071c01ae83b9cdc418c467a7e95b6940b5c5.camel@yandex.ru> <86bk6p8zqs.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="24119"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Hi-Angel@yandex.ru, rms@gnu.org, dmitry@gutov.dev, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 04 12:00:45 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rsJtl-000634-9e for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 04 Apr 2024 12:00:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rsJst-0005zZ-IM; Thu, 04 Apr 2024 05:59:51 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rsJsr-0005xo-PA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 04 Apr 2024 05:59:49 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic312-20.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com ([74.6.128.82]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rsJso-0006wH-Fa for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 04 Apr 2024 05:59:49 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=aol.com; s=a2048; t=1712224783; bh=BJW81rqHbiaUsbvusDck+CK7Os3N9yIRVaMCIeE5dLw=; h=Date:From:To:CC:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=qiyzQQeuxhgXiKWQX/jPpsgRrVPkWepGyO1ONmL4x5M0YWZKoPs1TFcv6BymjFDubVP2xuwXAFxNTNfIDIgoTMPvDdD74mO+YxXUFtSyt6DMKrsYJwTxmYSWbV2HiLOTGy1mQkQYLjlswcRxftUYlY/eAa4ytlH2EHf3peCGGcnXxoHFOdXt8FoSkN+6CNcksKFapYtgT58obADBArI+RWp4sRYjRBF4HsgTHHgnphQiwbzUPGa5nbD4aHW4///tEPEQh8vGhpBhSR/881+nDtK5aMsqpDw2KY+LnpIfP0eU19sOAlanMOvwiuMhX33RIR+cnsehufrq0vAwONsY0Q== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1712224783; bh=H/3JbppNemiKJ3K1NwIm95MbtFJ+VyHz/2kOg4+7/J4=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=YH6eLZFJaJIYbz6690VDSgFU+okF0R/i5vNRqfAUytk+dCNxQVDG9xJ/WuoFijkTw8qcuB1mRneyp4+2zI7Ae8jL1ixjKwE0kBRKBCqtxMHfW+KGrIP2xf7wiq1cQT1bTakZ+2XM1H/9bnkPNYiLYOfMMUyFpgVislPjzmsFL1YEQIKoDafMUfbaSfVMLOiZBIYidbsBoA4Rh3BQKCMdn3eLBfXaTJPCMF16ND8vyzBqvKhMyWyJX3Rho1zM/hA9UgHX+e+9jKe3UQeozVrT+LlUVB4du7Nolq1ul99dA26S0V+AkBnYsGZWb2KVBXM4CZMp+dk56EXDavsD9psgjw== X-YMail-OSG: utU88PgVM1mqMqdOjJLb3_83p6HGOs2L8BjLDZye9rJRzUhYGkc7XPAouFmv0Hr kvJXMMIOYlxh1c3PHiN4SiokEa._yTeJcQBQOoNXuKQIFdiajBqOqpVkoeHKUbLd.M7jh6iAIzT2 tyVXbm8Fd.0EIkomj0XffmqcM1b.N1FIYDX8VAKbMiB2aqeEJixQWOg1k5MPIqDzNTLbfSnzJ31J ORCVcYXBYxUTI4J56rSTjS7amJnjXxiLVE.Uz6xmPqa42SnmWxq4gltxRz_d9pWXTNymMfuyp9Mh z3sUdv9BgpQp6_WWf1ZjtLVNMRFNj77bIPxFIsEaHbT5xXH0MqfOtTV4Bg_ywjjIW3SHk2AikRJb WrES9izG7YaFr9ug2b3EVeftnJHBTWReMjOfM6nFg5Wkcwbt4lAN8snvgqhyCIBnlpI4H_Q5qNPt 61kSe0pB7yeQ_a_VHLR_dT.DFEbrrov1yqy8Qv8JoZU4aHd2wsXpANULYmVnOhNBTs.hzQxLG4cg GGxGvXD989leMn7ANQK8li5VWkguBQW02jZw1zXX8Cvv4gv8vmSMtxbON6XF3iJ6HQFX._3t.eoP 5jLihVmn3HCqelEorY65VG5JfsCtjLGpPbBIKm6nQv5vrTPwVviKP9E1XmAK8K2f31_eHLLX_xV6 3iJ7PXqODSCWjwY26qtS3zyeWCjvD28XHDzPXvculfQmLsP0HRJ.q3Y3oRIIyvbUirEghyKqfHpP OZL7m9ChAUNomfb1Ez.6Ea5SsgcaCE2osjg7HUKRLUI8CsIJkAN7VKBHq4L4vRpKsIWdBIFVDhd2 gHnpa.1s8LdsWX2a4P5H2B9GqDFhszpDO04TVVvmSU X-Sonic-MF: X-Sonic-ID: ea9c6573-74e3-4912-b0b0-f2601e575702 Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic312.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Thu, 4 Apr 2024 09:59:43 +0000 Original-Received: by hermes--production-ir2-7bc88bfc75-f22ds (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID bf5498728515c7552938e81851d831aa; Thu, 04 Apr 2024 09:59:39 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <86bk6p8zqs.fsf@gnu.org> X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.22205 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.aol Received-SPF: pass client-ip=74.6.128.82; envelope-from=spacibba@aol.com; helo=sonic312-20.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:317515 Archived-At: Hi Eli On April 4, 2024 7:26:35 AM GMT+02:00, Eli Zaretskii wrot= e: >> Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2024 22:12:44 +0200 >> From: Ergus >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii , rms@gnu=2Eorg, dmitry@gutov=2Edev,= =20 >> emacs-devel@gnu=2Eorg >>=20 >> My basic concept of OOSC (probably mistaken) is that the sources of the >> project are those required to reproduce a program, because otherwise it >> is not possible or are too difficult/expensive to reproduce=2E >>=20 >> If I change project=2Eel, then project=2Eelc is not valid anymore and n= eeds >> to be regenerated=2E=2E=2E so, project=2Eel is the source and the elc i= s a >> target (not necessarily a final one) > >The same is true for a change in configure=2Eac: the configure script is >no longer valid after that, and needs to be rebuilt=2E > And that's why the newer build systems generate the equivalent to the conf= igure also out of sources=2E Or use the equivalent to configure=2Eac direct= ly as input, generating everything out of sources=2E >> In the same line, when we do out of sources compilation it may be >> possible to remove the `build` directory and have the project sources >> exactly as downloaded from sources=2E Without any other clean >> needed=2E=2E=2E > >That's not how the GNU build infrastructure works=2E You have the >distclean target in Makefile to clean up the tree for the new build=2E > Makefile does not support oosc at all=2E Actually CMake generates the make= files outside sources=2E >> Also in same line, for example, when using GIT_NAMESPACE the project=2E= el >> will change with the namespace, but the elc won't (as not tracked by >> git), so GIT_NAMESPACE becomes inconsistent and requires a regeneration >> of =2Eelc, so, not a source, but a target > >That is a problem with project=2Eel, I think, not with how Emacs is >built=2E In every project, when you bootstrap it, i=2Ee=2E build from th= e >VCS repository, there are some generated files that are part of the >source tree=2E > Indeed, CMake and actually most of newer autotools projects prefer to gene= rate those files out of sources too=2E >> Finally when executing from build1 it may be possible to access the >> version of project=2Eelc used when the project was compiled in that >> directory=2E=2E=2E independently of if I changed project=2Eel latter an= d >> compiled in build2=2E Latter actions in source + compilation in build2 >> should not affect the consistency of build1=2E > >You are talking about modifying project=2Eel while it is being used by a >running Emacs session? In that case, all bets are off, I think=2E No I mean having two emacs builds in different subdirectories=2E For examp= le one compiled before certain change and the other after=20 --=20 Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E