From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Pedro Andres Aranda Gutierrez Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: Re: ns-do-applescript Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 08:34:01 +0200 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000dfa7b605e048f68b" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="38223"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" To: emacs-devel , Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue May 31 08:45:15 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nvvcv-0009kz-Ik for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 31 May 2022 08:45:13 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:60904 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nvvct-0000io-Le for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 31 May 2022 02:45:11 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43792) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nvvSZ-0003qe-WD for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 31 May 2022 02:34:32 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ej1-x62a.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::62a]:34368) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nvvSY-00064b-2d for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 31 May 2022 02:34:31 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-ej1-x62a.google.com with SMTP id q21so24683053ejm.1 for ; Mon, 30 May 2022 23:34:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=EGbt/wWRQN/hA16FFuxWE/EcE8bHM3MV/xvMBZ7eQX0=; b=gt9yKvwHoV3EB1Lq88QbhYXrHnEVVGaNpWCORMt1rjjnb3vJ9AxOBcmvb1CZvxOPBQ r7TkRJc1FQ8Ws/ACfdULSEXuihFyabGr2bjM+GyX0ni1Q1M/+SHLqNZjFKS9rAcLnaAY MhYUl3QxwkHv/RtingxsRT/bZP5GVXxaVRvZNnc+I1GH6B6LL/TZX1uZA6A/rcjNDFb7 qcLX5VWTjdHqZ38euwD/VSuSJnNJ6xAEsTa4IJxka7luVM1/XwCQzb00sk+Z4GenbO+0 G6XuXV7bEp1y4DNGFRivftMFy0gq7zB/jB3n1wt9q/oL+e6KvyWGakIeehf+z1exzgdC eBDQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=EGbt/wWRQN/hA16FFuxWE/EcE8bHM3MV/xvMBZ7eQX0=; b=xIlQcyz8fjirhq60dqTbZxLnnsqAg3nHnYfm0uOkyBP/JFgLrmu20KmWFWV57FQhcM j2P0LrerakfH8QyoiMwVUYlhMI7vIXSrJMj59WAgqCXQ2g4BhjsvURbk+pVB4QsYMwCO PMdVHRavjfUm/mYbtrvTgwngLF4lpiedodA8tKgGXhDyq0cKnJnAiOyMCx8OTnWazGbh 8gkRGZuiz1yOGrhUaxFTwU1yS+J2DWlkES8tt6oOH4FlZD8a3gK5ggbU+lLs7PDtjndz jFZVFQNZZiEKAdIpKZsAf4VmrgEZeV1+OkNEkZ1E+R/HiLSFr+eVrdMDXsROzEsfr1+F Ra8w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531MSkD5KchvV/AGtBlosN2fpri5mXptY9DkkfQ72pRRYVvH6rGS KB5yugVTeNFz6QazBJNa4bWOI34xnp/tqJI4fvd/tSg8T+s= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJy8Xx9bp8eLMwMtwrWaLZsJEy09L+KNluqoV2n8ANyZlqjwGwdDaHUpQYoV70iN4UtSYUIgZ9UfrD2aPmTIIlM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:1b03:b0:6ff:78d4:c140 with SMTP id mp3-20020a1709071b0300b006ff78d4c140mr8221940ejc.554.1653978867671; Mon, 30 May 2022 23:34:27 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::62a; envelope-from=paaguti@gmail.com; helo=mail-ej1-x62a.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:290394 Archived-At: --000000000000dfa7b605e048f68b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message: 15 Date: Mon, 30 May 2022 10:50:10 +0800 From: Po Lu > To: Jon Snader > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org > Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: ns-do-applescript > Message-ID: <871qwbd999.fsf@yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain > Jon Snader writes: ... >>> The ns-do-applescript call is (or could be considered) simply a call >>> to an OS specific interface routine. It's useful for many things >>> besides getting contacts and its presence in *in the macOS Emacs >>> build* hurts no one, whereas its removal is sure to cause lots of >>> inconvenience for Mac users and those writing packages for the >>> platform. > We don't want to make things convenient for Mac users, when those things > are not possible on a free system. Just as Emacs doesn't provide > "OS-specific interface routines" to perform tasks on non-free operating > systems that are not possible on free ones. Yes, I repent, I confess... I use Emacs on a macOS... as I write shell scripts (bash/zsh), gawk, Inkscape, GIMP, LaTEX, etc. Exactly the same way I do this on my Linux system(s) and on the VMs I create and share. And while I'm using DBus in Linux for forward/backward searching between *TeX and PDF, I do use ns-do-applescript for some of that magic on macOS. Same goes for bringing the Emacs window to the top of the desktop and for other functions. I think all the traffic started because someone asked whether a pure elisp alternative to ns-do-applescript could be found and call-process to osascript was proposed. Humbly yours showed how to do such a thing (at least on my very rudimentary use of osascript). So, yes, you can write it in ELisp, but I can't tell you whether it makes sense to scare people away from Emacs by not providing functionality (IMvvHO that would be a pity). The argument "now you see what you could be doing in Linux" has already given some fruits in my experience. Best, /PA -- Fragen sind nicht da um beantwortet zu werden, Fragen sind da um gestellt zu werden Georg Kreisler Headaches with a Juju log: unit-basic-16: 09:17:36 WARNING juju.worker.uniter.operation we should run a leader-deposed hook here, but we can't yet --000000000000dfa7b605e048f68b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Message: 15
Dat= e: Mon, 30 May 2022 10:50:10 +0800
From: Po Lu <luangruo@yahoo.com>
> To: J= on Snader <jcs@irrea= l.org>
> Cc:=C2=A0emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: ns-do-ap= plescript
> Message-ID: <871qwbd999.fsf@yahoo.com>
> Content-Type:= text/plain

> Jon Snader <jcs@irreal.org> writes:
...
>>> The n= s-do-applescript call is (or could be considered) simply a call
>>= > to an OS specific interface routine. It's useful for many things>>> besides getting contacts and its presence in *in the macOS E= macs
>>> build* hurts no one, whereas its removal is sure to ca= use lots of
>>> inconvenience for Mac users and those writing p= ackages for the
>>> platform.

> We don't want to = make things convenient for Mac users, when those things
> are not pos= sible on a free system.=C2=A0 Just as Emacs doesn't provide
> &qu= ot;OS-specific interface routines" to perform tasks on non-free operat= ing
> systems that are not possible on free ones.

<= /div>
<flagelante>
Yes, I repent, I confess... I use Em= acs on a macOS...
</flagelante>
as I write shell = scripts (bash/zsh), gawk, Inkscape, GIMP, LaTEX, etc. Exactly the same way = I do this on my Linux system(s) and on the VMs I create and share.

And while I'm using DBus in Linux for forward/backward= searching between *TeX and PDF, I do use ns-do-applescript for some of tha= t magic on macOS. Same goes for bringing the Emacs window to the top of the= desktop and for other functions.=C2=A0

I think al= l the traffic started because someone asked whether a pure elisp alternativ= e to ns-do-applescript could be found and call-process to osascript was pro= posed. Humbly yours showed how to do such a thing (at least on my very rudi= mentary use of osascript).
=C2=A0
So, yes, you can writ= e it in ELisp, but I can't tell you whether it makes sense to scare peo= ple away from Emacs by not providing functionality (IMvvHO that would be a = pity). The argument "now you see what you could be doing in Linux"= ; has already given some fruits in my experience.

= Best, /PA
--
Fragen sind nicht da um beantworte= t zu werden,
Fragen sind da um gestellt zu werden
Georg K= reisler

Headaches with a Juju log:
unit-= basic-16: 09:17:36 WARNING juju.worker.uniter.operation we should run a lea= der-deposed hook here, but we can't yet

=
--000000000000dfa7b605e048f68b--