From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lennart Borgman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: CL package serious deficiencies Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2012 03:19:28 +0100 Message-ID: References: <33271707.post@talk.nabble.com> <87fwemcwlx.fsf@spindle.srvr.nix> <8739amb3rf.fsf@spindle.srvr.nix> <87pqdqxebg.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1328667597 18091 80.91.229.3 (8 Feb 2012 02:19:57 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2012 02:19:57 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Nix , egnarts-ms , Stefan Monnier , Drew Adams , Emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Feb 08 03:19:55 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rux8U-0002P6-Nn for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 08 Feb 2012 03:19:54 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53961 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rux8T-00072f-Rm for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:19:53 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:53837) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rux8Q-00072L-Tg for Emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:19:52 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rux8P-0003tF-ME for Emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:19:50 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-lpp01m010-f41.google.com ([209.85.215.41]:33607) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rux8P-0003t3-FJ for Emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:19:49 -0500 Original-Received: by lamf4 with SMTP id f4so78889lam.0 for ; Tue, 07 Feb 2012 18:19:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=dvFU/co434dOKImKOV/uyxN7o4jAHz8owF/Jf3IiNcI=; b=ZWSdZzXEX18V28/UHYqkyoUJVa4BcnuuxZ6KBXkJIzBvNTyAv3ruPTg6J7lR+kGbcy yZ2SdJdwK4Hpv3xZ2DRl+f7t7jiXJqelWB0l7D44dMIKielvMtT3sESTHQP/6VM5oNFs Vc/VTE/n2TylsEKVrHqhfI15WUXOpnK0PgoK8= Original-Received: by 10.112.48.36 with SMTP id i4mr7062891lbn.84.1328667588314; Tue, 07 Feb 2012 18:19:48 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.112.12.6 with HTTP; Tue, 7 Feb 2012 18:19:28 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <87pqdqxebg.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 209.85.215.41 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:148344 Archived-At: On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 03:13, Stephen J. Turnbull wrot= e: > Nix writes: > =C2=A0> On 7 Feb 2012, Stefan Monnier said: > =C2=A0> > =C2=A0> >> I've never understood what's wrong with including cl.el, nor w= hy the > =C2=A0> > > =C2=A0> > The main issue is namespace. =C2=A0If someone goes through the = code to rename > =C2=A0> > it all to "cl-*", then we won't need to avoid using it. > =C2=A0> > =C2=A0> Aha. I'd agree with *that*: it's always been hellishly unclear wh= ich > =C2=A0> things are in cl or not. > > Oh, s**t. =C2=A0*We* do *not* agree, since we're moving in the direction = of > exact Common Lisp conformance for the subset of features we provide (I > think Aidan has the intention of reducing cl.el to > > =C2=A0 =C2=A0;;; cl --- Common Lisp emulation for Emacsen > =C2=A0 =C2=A0(provide 'cl) > =C2=A0 =C2=A0;;; end of cl.el > > in the near future). > > Not that anybody on this list *should* care about that, but just in > case.... ;-) This reminds me that the help functions does not work for cl things. A serious attempt to make those functions useful should probably fix that too.