From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Changes for emacs 28 - ibuffer the default buffer-listing thing Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2020 09:48:15 +0100 Message-ID: References: <20200906133719.cu6yaldvenxubcqq.ref@Ergus> <20200906133719.cu6yaldvenxubcqq@Ergus> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000020d69105aeb5488c" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="27553"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel To: Ergus Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Sep 07 10:49:01 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kFCpg-0006zA-6Y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 07 Sep 2020 10:49:00 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57980 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kFCpf-0001Vy-86 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 07 Sep 2020 04:48:59 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56138) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kFCpA-00015O-PG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Sep 2020 04:48:28 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-io1-xd2b.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2b]:33807) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kFCp9-0007OO-2F for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Sep 2020 04:48:28 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-io1-xd2b.google.com with SMTP id m17so13236371ioo.1 for ; Mon, 07 Sep 2020 01:48:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ZNh3m3CgynixzIHGJifDOpfuQQk2fg3RvndfV2su8WU=; b=SlJhz7rd7Y0Tyj19MIhgpAPOuMr5KnN9806TkZctmjfi0c4nW20cezpyD7O0stDxL0 bNIaykPEFm/xhbIiiZs+g05aobPfTfDV/0nL+KvBn7GNDQprKAOYGJXUebWoEw0R/SHY u1ioMg99SnSfCCDxk3j8o+23pykENoJ5LViuK8gCEI/QQyOSOMV896ZGeC1xfhzvOoBr NPKWV9DhCBf+eXnwFjzRZKExCCM+KnZrJZK+hCKLaC79o58sqVDhzyPFKTzTy7DN8OUF 7/TBpqxgyc6hKR0mRLCwDu2CD4mlM1/lhUiz0tUSlXdi1uVVb+DXpqh56Wb29BVhsJ+5 bUvg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ZNh3m3CgynixzIHGJifDOpfuQQk2fg3RvndfV2su8WU=; b=qpAIHQX+riIlEgBL7Tfk2RiVBvr2uYnT1juQLryBWdS0P5yzez6cziG2C18lPwShC1 adhv34Ev56C/vahkpnxndAMK5LCotsLqiP2zK+t0HfYxqvJFPnd3WtKDTg2qxl9SkQAZ alnhmy5hP7G08wuIO+3GW4w3jzi7d4vyIY3SHbXMkGykLzaJTHj1Ifp2tfgY3O8BNt/Q 8syg8MKr80fbbwiV+XVHatfaD9BRhA3syyA1a7AGAeZwDIG5XT/KwxkTFIp8gvrcRjph afSLUQpIuHlZY4PUZzeYL4XCiGcUwBHri6GPcnO+u006KUwdbAX4DxoSxi/+G1+f9PkM jBaA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533S+JZ74ofsXjvtwwJuga0hhgU3qMTSy0qUEpCDp0KrmqDZMvAD vPVnr1AArJqTX+N/Jl3DYBeU2tPlMmSoYhPNy80= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzfVd/cZ+R0XMHMlkXZkceXtJvxJuflrvvFOuMLySZihDMXoI7aFaYHIVEhH7fHTpoho/D3jj/64+03NeQ+UeU= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:8f10:: with SMTP id r16mr16889949iod.165.1599468505975; Mon, 07 Sep 2020 01:48:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20200906133719.cu6yaldvenxubcqq@Ergus> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2b; envelope-from=joaotavora@gmail.com; helo=mail-io1-xd2b.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:254617 Archived-At: --00000000000020d69105aeb5488c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Sep 6, 2020 at 2:37 PM Ergus wrote: > 3) Substitute list-buffers with ibuffer: This is actually in the TODO > but for interactive users ibuffer offers a bit more modern > experience. So the proposition is just to set ibuffer to the default > bindings as so far it already offers all the list-buffers' > functionalities. I support this change. But we should make sure that the advanced functionality that Ibuffer offers isn't confusing. When I first saw Ibuffer some many years ago, I was very confused about "filters" and "filter groups". I think the top level menus "Tools", "Operate" and "Buffers", should all be grouped under some kind of "Buffer management" or "Buffer list" top level entry. Also, we should have pre-configured "filter groups", like group-per-project, which we can probably do with project.el (maybe this is already a thing, but I still have custom code for it). Idiot-proof, example-rich documentation in the Emacs manual is probably also a very good thing to have. Jo=C3=A3o --00000000000020d69105aeb5488c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Sun, Sep 6, 2020 at 2:37 PM Ergus <spacibba@aol.com> wrote:

> 3) Substitut= e list-buffers with ibuffer: This is actually in the TODO
> but for i= nteractive users ibuffer offers a bit more modern
> experience. So th= e proposition is just to set ibuffer to the default
> bindings as so = far it already offers all the list-buffers'
> functionalitie= s.

I support this change.=C2=A0 But we should make= sure that the advanced
functionality that Ibuffer offers is= n't confusing. When I first saw Ibuffer
some many years ago, = I was very confused about "filters" and
"filt= er groups".=C2=A0 I think the top level menus "Tools", "= ;Operate" and
"Buffers", should all be groupe= d under some kind of "Buffer management"
or "= Buffer list" top level entry.

Also, we should= have pre-configured "filter groups", like
group-p= er-project, which we can probably do with project.el
(maybe = this is already a thing, but I still have custom code for it).
Idiot-proof, example-rich documentation in the Emacs manual
is probably also a very good thing to have.

Jo=C3=A3o
--00000000000020d69105aeb5488c--