From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: What's missing in ELisp that makes people want to use cl-lib? Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2023 21:10:00 +0000 Message-ID: References: <46ab3c7d-d820-4bb4-8ec4-97c614d7c8a0@alphapapa.net> <871qd8sfdx.fsf@posteo.net> <838r7g8pys.fsf@gnu.org> <87bkcbrgnr.fsf@posteo.net> <25924.21015.19614.951576@orion.rgrjr.com> <87bkc4jpja.fsf@dataswamp.org> <12da6bcb-1818-7fbe-12af-8d4607724332@gutov.dev> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000005bcef20609aa83b3" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="9743"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Alan Mackenzie , =?UTF-8?B?QmrDtnJuIEJpZGFy?= , emacs-devel To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Nov 08 22:11:06 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1r0ppJ-0002HP-3n for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 08 Nov 2023 22:11:05 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r0pog-0002jG-9U; Wed, 08 Nov 2023 16:10:27 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r0poa-0002iu-OP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Nov 2023 16:10:21 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-lf1-x133.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::133]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r0poV-0000St-ND for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Nov 2023 16:10:20 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-lf1-x133.google.com with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-50931355d48so150663e87.3 for ; Wed, 08 Nov 2023 13:10:15 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1699477813; x=1700082613; darn=gnu.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=g+3asUPd87L4LH0JB3lDcIuTHUrQIyH+BRBKzfwfaOo=; b=H52/ym1ATYhehdCboLH/2w+gGCBwkU46kat7e6cTiOhx0XyXU2mBCnHNQdJm5BH4pT Sk9OEVyl9hwDdR01HD8YVhcYAbqvm9b1uJcXZILtlNO7LjLtJKgMfkDfDs0YNQN9aTa8 hfKlmMnXhPXO9t+vHEkvbHei5aQSZt37Hhy9rWGjWdlbI/ci/1hHOGIOvUdsd29dBuRm TMWOfVZ2fQHQPRE8T9q9r+KSwGghHh24YvFU2GbDj+FANlQbDTg1aMptJ/u+lb4p+pYl p148D5PUMnHastutZa3a91cwF04LApBf/xzM5p/fEEkHXlS3k+5DNEwOwGdaby9uiCkQ xgrQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1699477813; x=1700082613; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=g+3asUPd87L4LH0JB3lDcIuTHUrQIyH+BRBKzfwfaOo=; b=E100uTG1KUPmaUJ6dyeWz6Eg5VYM6zvMBrvfxbDqkjGB8E4QssmpvYgszSQq89Z1k5 W600O5ctLh/R8VC1y2SFmO1eGJkDQkKQ7r/Ktktm4gESNj/lvs/u/rHekzFLI9AJUf8a eDXDQQUvGWQGi6piTjSoBpwWU2LzGY1QAVGpKSEPcuvjC4jCnIttKXFMg0Q7aALaQrHQ UsfqbZE8xEaNhrckjJvC+yPd79qtx+1lQOMZ4xOVKQVdnHmDq87wkpv3AKerjHgBkVXb IcJz7mK1RC/6GCImNRMjKl128PpPy7L9pBAXEB55ubDwLJIYhH66Egqt3f0dP2mCX3cw sWzA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyT6+nJX7Xiah8l5Bgr1ZgjolAVGkEM9gkKhHdPurNfXOzcJHD4 XZkRyTXErRq1wACJmeDBlibHpAgxvBrPdDncTOBJLBN0 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFRdWlrKj0u/yHx1NxLVyc9HGMRaATOcSKzm0z9JXm1nI0DqBaAnGvBfz4zCDWBExp24O6cc0fTwPMpD1bXFPE= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:2302:b0:507:a86d:89bb with SMTP id o2-20020a056512230200b00507a86d89bbmr2875683lfu.23.1699477813184; Wed, 08 Nov 2023 13:10:13 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <12da6bcb-1818-7fbe-12af-8d4607724332@gutov.dev> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::133; envelope-from=joaotavora@gmail.com; helo=mail-lf1-x133.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:312363 Archived-At: --0000000000005bcef20609aa83b3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Nov 8, 2023, 20:20 Dmitry Gutov wrote: > On 08/11/2023 19:18, Alan Mackenzie wrote: > > Throughout this long discussion, this indiscriminate use of cl-lib has > > been supported only by occasional contributers. Those who actually > > maintain other people's code, apart from (I think) Eli, Richard and > > myself, have been conspicuously silent. > > I like cl-lib (it could be optimized better still, but it's good for > certain uses), and this discussion doesn't look like it will reach any > constructive conclusion, so it didn't seem worth it to spend time on it. > If it needed any confirmation, I too like cl-lib and I too help maintain other people's code in the Emacs core tree as well as maintaining a number of libraries I have authored. I read many styles of Elisp here and am not really phased by any particular programming technique being discussed here (cl-lib, seq, pcase, verbose while loops with catch/throw, etc etc). Jo=C3=A3o --0000000000005bcef20609aa83b3 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Wed, Nov 8, 2023, 20:20 Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@gutov.dev= > wrote:
On 08/11/2023 19:18, Al= an Mackenzie wrote:
> Throughout this long discussion, this indiscriminate use of cl-lib has=
> been supported only by occasional contributers.=C2=A0 Those who actual= ly
> maintain other people's code, apart from (I think) Eli, Richard an= d
> myself, have been conspicuously silent.

I like cl-lib (it could be optimized better still, but it's good for certain uses), and this discussion doesn't look like it will reach any =
constructive conclusion, so it didn't seem worth it to spend time on it= .

If it needed any confirmation, I too like cl-lib and I too help maintain o= ther people's code in the Emacs core tree as well as maintaining a numb= er of libraries I have authored. I read many styles of Elisp here and am no= t really phased by any particular programming technique being discussed her= e (cl-lib, seq, pcase, verbose while loops with catch/throw, etc etc).

Jo=C3=A3o


--0000000000005bcef20609aa83b3--