From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] New package: transient Date: Sun, 3 May 2020 23:04:40 +0100 Message-ID: References: <87368npxw4.fsf@bernoul.li> <87ftcnxu5m.fsf@bernoul.li> <83y2qezlpd.fsf@gnu.org> <83tv12zjx1.fsf@gnu.org> <20200429101755.GF24737@tuxteam.de> <838sicw4do.fsf@gnu.org> <83zhaqu89z.fsf@gnu.org> <83sggiu2p9.fsf@gnu.org> <83r1w2s9wi.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006a8c3605a4c59adc" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="59536"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , tomas@tuxteam.de, Richard Stallman , Drew Adams , Emacs developers To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon May 04 00:05:28 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jVMjn-000FP2-WB for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 00:05:28 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42370 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVMjn-0000ln-22 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 18:05:27 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:39772) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVMjF-0000DJ-Bb for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 18:04:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-il1-x130.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::130]:32815) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVMjE-0003Sr-HJ; Sun, 03 May 2020 18:04:53 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-il1-x130.google.com with SMTP id q10so9552689ile.0; Sun, 03 May 2020 15:04:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=1KHocn9P0IzsrNz9W+batWtnfYQrHgnqKo1ENo6FL/g=; b=amkHMjuBB+5KQjqRfuu9AQGzW5loqwMU64DRRYGikUf/OcQ+YvmvqDhQrmBQYD6em3 RBGi//p+zkskwzF5clIqxBW9TSGdXxi2fy89FMcEqrhjPqtiF35Hb0fvIYsv3yInf0pJ ZNhDfp9bO68I4jlRc8QQL7sbLqg318d1sVB/O8QBjJceQ2WLamK/PbenKD+8Y1Ol9C3A zGmSbe5RjFrMzgaRXNeJkUxRu99CtmmW+juWAz6F1wdDPgvDGH0DefOMoarwnkksyUOn JrqEIL99BOQvmH244LIwpkXGs7bpe2W0HTLWSlxKeUXE1rX/ne+r4n1BD0ZYlSPTo/3r a2Mg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=1KHocn9P0IzsrNz9W+batWtnfYQrHgnqKo1ENo6FL/g=; b=AySXQil/NZ3hwTZa9M6EC7v1wI6C+J3q4LwYeupqvN24eM/m1vTp5bukUTe1S8ss6Q h0EO8vbM02AnH0IZsZSPxmCXKj7w/YIRGzmqRpiLXrGblzvy6SOTwxqePbPzlHr/aOrb LE9DJ/iNMDp5Mj4YZ6QC9jqdW+JreiskLZpHIPj2hibr4ZkLuyiPr48zR1DU8SD1Gvi6 exdV/nI2UZLaF/oPPAoyOKUJk6sNXTGaPja1Z3oFQRCO7WFhzYOGmVb3uxfbBnBQhdUL QDZXkTR7RYbSG+Sux2k/JHPaloYrBfRUbyKsjIL9R08pnYnqg+tQxhJDGUSdbMeAlPEB yTWA== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuY+6oPEAcWp2gLmXE0ykor5ImmRhHGOJyV5TAG8TUiNN5aynU6W /zHlse5l9+HRkijhaqDLvMv2z2iKfA/C8ryD2cs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLKhSp/B+94koFPS/MgnSffkqtI8Bzx9jCTjEZLC3XVasaJhHQKdac2NsC3dVUtvRYksmRzVsFsJD6eobpqL6w= X-Received: by 2002:a92:9e11:: with SMTP id q17mr14012530ili.137.1588543489738; Sun, 03 May 2020 15:04:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::130; envelope-from=joaotavora@gmail.com; helo=mail-il1-x130.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -10 X-Spam_score: -1.1 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:248747 Archived-At: --0000000000006a8c3605a4c59adc Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, May 3, 2020, 22:18 Stefan Monnier wrote: > > That's the rub/misunderstanding, I think. That > > namespaces are used does not imply that naming > > need be based on object type. > > The propositions here aren't to group based on *types*. > Please stop those strawman arguments, again. > E.g. the `re-` renaming is not about any rind of "regular > expression type". They're based on the same notions of namespacing used > in modules/packages/younameit, which is also the namespacing used in > Elisp packages, as a matter of fact, so it's really not a concept > foreign to Elisp. There's ambiguity in Elisp, there has always been. The first word can be just a word or designate a namespace. The clearer the way the prefix conveys which one of the two it means, the better. But ambiguity because of shared namespace is inevitable. So list- and string- are bad choices. process- and package- and request- are slightly better, if one momentarily erases the verbs from one's mind. re- and rx- are better, though kinda short. gnus-, eww- , yas- are great, IMO. Jo=C3=A3o --0000000000006a8c3605a4c59adc Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Sun, May 3, 2020, 22:18 Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
> That's the rub/misunderstanding, = I think.=C2=A0 That
> namespaces are used does not imply that naming
> need be based on object type.

The propositions here aren't to group based on *types*.
Please stop those strawman arguments, again.

E.g. the `re-<foo>` renaming is not about any rind of "regular expression type".=C2=A0 They're based on the same notions of names= pacing used
in modules/packages/younameit, which is also the namespacing used in
Elisp packages, as a matter of fact, so it's really not a concept
foreign to Elisp.

There's ambiguity in Elisp, there has always been. The fir= st word can be just a word or designate a namespace. The clearer the way th= e prefix conveys which one of the two it means, the better.=C2=A0 But ambig= uity because of shared namespace is inevitable. So list- and string- are ba= d choices.=C2=A0 =C2=A0process- and package- and request- are slightly bett= er, if one momentarily erases the verbs from one's mind. re- and rx- ar= e better, though kinda short. gnus-, eww- , yas- are great, IMO.

Jo=C3=A3o
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