From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Proper namespaces in Elisp Date: Wed, 6 May 2020 01:15:55 +0100 Message-ID: References: <237fe643-c14d-5406-b35d-a30dcd42c5ed@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="81368"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: nic@ferrier.me.uk, =?UTF-8?Q?Cl=C3=A9ment_Pit=2DClaudel?= , emacs-devel , Stefan Monnier , Helmut Eller To: Andrea Corallo Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed May 06 02:17:00 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jW7kC-000L2p-45 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 06 May 2020 02:17:00 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56766 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jW7kA-0004T7-Gg for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 05 May 2020 20:16:58 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58176) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jW7jO-0003zA-21 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 May 2020 20:16:10 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-io1-xd2d.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2d]:39546) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jW7jM-0000En-QB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 May 2020 20:16:09 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-io1-xd2d.google.com with SMTP id w4so326164ioc.6 for ; Tue, 05 May 2020 17:16:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=TqLO2hSGcedBh7f7K9VhIa9JP+luCbQ6ymr5wSiUW18=; b=QvmHUrwpP9vybuJPy7VoskbetbT+PP1ovAlzV1ChSggnXzRa/0TTe6HJH2Xk72m9b3 Cy56a3VOIBRpyMJAclAgJVY9mJreIatgW2KF+V2PIAMeBjSpkOfNGQ+sgwKCZpkP/deE 8AYbUMFDVGXFXpnIw9bildKjuX4uIT+fYHFGM1O5zYWlpgmoKBnGKzvhrLkMSjLbNG3J QRK6GsgmUMWM/6EnnwvT36dV4ZymXqdJGRJ8iZ7nJ7OcLzrg1t+KCGjcBsHjYk/Tz+Vt vPv/y3ZrozoUmrsCL6KjUcksgMd9wtdCyYEncSkfIZ6qowpBhV5UE7FNcNpRaby10Vjv 4ltQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=TqLO2hSGcedBh7f7K9VhIa9JP+luCbQ6ymr5wSiUW18=; b=UwkdL/dyhM/HnvnAL75NQJaY2ThLXnsOj+2BcNS/MajzOg6ivFAxPVsBc2xXDgMCBC NOanAdkUIIYf44qfjlyDCodZX2acRW//5JxMup3P9963WIJtPHcpCqDpEwmaqd5vWESJ H+A48wK99S/M/KG/jKoyocC311iyrzTsqJTRJBE+uVCoQ1Nwtxgu+cIqhgBqKFTZ5u3r cf81oMeuO2u3b08mbeI1gblonb5iyVXtfHmwDwPhJN+4/LnR+Az10fOFa+9SbZe4fhPV EiaE5ayjwedBHtrEoLurZhVZmMQWM3lQd4U1ya9wC7hOAen8IIM0vxmTOrXadGKqqv6w qguA== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PubhJ9JoeJXKKPwsIAcLOldfa4QFW7YeH4ttAstJZKQArWOjgc6Z fydThZSREjaYVxLbSgR7rtAR0QB6o4V7XMkW+sg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypKzLhIIgs/bVFo9HLFXdUhzSCNBkFrBJp8Fl8JV9ciA+hnHmbWzri7nGAYE6eRvBOXd8Ymhd4laqxxA/bdnXCk= X-Received: by 2002:a02:5bc9:: with SMTP id g192mr6198251jab.136.1588724167034; Tue, 05 May 2020 17:16:07 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2d; envelope-from=joaotavora@gmail.com; helo=mail-io1-xd2d.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -10 X-Spam_score: -1.1 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:249061 Archived-At: On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 12:37 AM Andrea Corallo wrote: > _If_ you allow, I can still think would be more convenient doing > A even if Hyperspec says must do B. So you want to also change the meaning of QUOTE because typing a colon is less convenient than typing a quote? Is it that you have to press the shift key to type the colon? I find that odd, but in that case, never use (defpackage foo :use), you can still make pretty good use of CL packages. > I must say this is one the points where your writing sounds is a bit > arrogant. I'm possibly wrong but I've to say I don't enjoy this > approach and the resulting tone of the conversation. I don't think it > serves your points. You dropped a paper casually, presumably to support your case, didn't give any framing, just left it there. I could say I found that a bit arrogant, too. So I went and actually read it and quoted it back to you. > > Not exactly categorical, i would say. > > So you could have just said "it's not my taste". > Papers just reflect the vision of the authors, this is how it works. > These are not papers describing scientific experiments. No, that's not how it works. I had a paper in the recent ELS (as did you, I understand) and I had to justify every assertion, particularly the ones concerning other people's work. So they are not mere opinions. There is an effort to justify positions, or when can't, do like the author of [2] did and at least frame them as a question of taste. But I'm spending my time in this list looking for hard facts to solve a real problem and I thought you had some to back up your strong statement of opposition. I must have misunderstood. Jo=C3=A3o