From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Drop the Copyright Assignment requirement for Emacs Date: Sat, 9 May 2020 10:48:34 +0100 Message-ID: References: <9mmFgzvrBwjt_n_VJyaJdXINraNi5HsGpwq-0MLeKiJA7kG2BQA4uywrzjyz7lpRS0OZDpjEi8lspOKYUA7P_QsODsDew_8nbH960G55fmY=@protonmail.com> <97DA7804-F647-4A1D-B8E0-AFFE7A324C64@gmail.com> <87d07xamrg.fsf@ericabrahamsen.net> <878silajdl.fsf@ericabrahamsen.net> <87tv18pyh4.fsf@russet.org.uk> <83zhaih0oz.fsf@gnu.org> <83pnbegsvm.fsf@gnu.org> <83imh5hby1.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="117257"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat May 09 11:49:37 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jXM6z-000UPB-Cc for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 11:49:37 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56860 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXM6y-0001Vo-Af for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 05:49:36 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:60398) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXM6C-0000bU-7A for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 05:48:48 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-il1-x131.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::131]:46112) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXM6B-0004Kt-8W; Sat, 09 May 2020 05:48:47 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-il1-x131.google.com with SMTP id x2so3761158ilp.13; Sat, 09 May 2020 02:48:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=bJtDBoGfcZ1CCkOjNt5fTnqIGMQ+bJ13pePOz3DfZBM=; b=SbIcY3VpoQFP1/G6kgDgcIUtbHpYsOCfyx0S76lScSeFDl8B0+4A+yz3WPWDg6YM65 9yS6PJ5v7+vTQIKNzAkXiK8jwSp+3WvbfdzUXO8Y2m7Zz5YAZI8rgWY1lF0eR3xHNU4w pS8gvb2HfqUnN2jeEtC+SeIr8keINfpK7+4NFmA66/3YKEWJfkQRKEW0z7PE8plmlCCr StmJqsG6aWhoEwwiknyfQJs3GAGddm/VeG0sCFSlGRGHfhh2rfTzrD6fXdyFXYJ4WTKd UaFRcrUWR1NVT6WO4vemLzVodL4aouddmbBlOPXTErvqzGuZWggo0lyJnTEuvnWbhWbs Z5KA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=bJtDBoGfcZ1CCkOjNt5fTnqIGMQ+bJ13pePOz3DfZBM=; b=cEBios91v1t4q2Jtizq9+XmTx0UI9XCkGKyaG9Xh1zUyAkSw3qhEiIfHags6rAdsNY dCFArjECJo2/pSfMneKwxqugbCY10QWRBwmNa3g+Qn0O6nWSJjjN77q6BFR0YWur8BrP KgKB0L3Lk+aDZhCVftfSyaBny2zmGjFRYhr1eG0UYQxyGvHLgGkO0Oeu9qljW/5HT8/2 4W/WVs61GdZbWG+np9szh636wSbBXQqm1XbS2Z8FoK08CnpJxR3h1bZopBPjQvRcWoeB rvv+iz9ba4lDPoG4k5aXjSh+pdl5MshrNCpnT4oiFPvcPcKSee2mB/YlIMi0wSzTaKy+ rG8A== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuavsnKRYuYsQYVMaaJ0pHAIlQNobRXM+781u4KZbtipeDpMMG12 zHBFpBM6hKkrLaHFAjB6Vj2+nARXxjA87ls2jZLVfXJOcXA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLPt8JzY7UObAnzPv1/9ugP+N+su6Uv157WUFQagIFPYfXhRJ4OPlyjOHDvrwnHy++HXfD0nHeVBXS0e1Pcptg= X-Received: by 2002:a92:4a11:: with SMTP id m17mr6958210ilf.125.1589017725443; Sat, 09 May 2020 02:48:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83imh5hby1.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::131; envelope-from=joaotavora@gmail.com; helo=mail-il1-x131.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -10 X-Spam_score: -1.1 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:249382 Archived-At: On Sat, May 9, 2020 at 7:14 AM Eli Zaretskii wrote: > That's what I thought, but this means GNU ELPA is just a special > branch of Emacs, Part of it is, kind of, since it distributes the very same files. Another part isn't really. > and apart of the above, all the other requirements > and code conventions should be identical, so that we could move > packages between the core and ELPA at will. That was my impression initially too. But in practice it evolved to a place for the "not quite ready for prime-time" cases: i.e. we let most everything in, provided they have copyright and adhere to some minimal conventions. So we don't uphold the same standard there, never did, I think. Nowadays, I see ELPA as a staging place for packages to come in, eventually make it into core _and_ back into ELPA as :core packages. Eglot, the LSP package, is in that situation: it is in ELPA but is developed on Github for now and ,there it has gathered contributors whom I ask for copyright assignments, GNU-style commits, etc. Soon, we'll discuss its integration into the core, and if it works out, I'll want to keep it in GNU ELPA as a :core packge. In the meantime, Emacs will have gained 3-4 Eglot regulars as new core Emacs contributors. How can it not "work out"? Well, this list might decide it doesn't have the technical merits yet or, more seriously, I messed up and forgot to require copyright for a significant contribution. I will often only ask if the contributor has started the process and let the commit go in if he confirms. But I don't double-check (I should, of course, and that's why it should be easier to do). I believe, Yasnippet, now maintained by Noam Postavski, is in a similar situation. It has all the copyright in order, but since some parts of it which are still a bit gory, it's better not import it into core until they are resolved. FWIW, I don't fully agree with Stefan: we should not require copyright assignment for inclusion in GNU ELPA if that introduces needless friction, but we should require of authors, maintainers or proponents that they make an effort to track down the contributors and solve this, otherwise it makes no sense for it to be there. Finally, above practical aspects, assigning copyright is declaring support for an idea larger than the FSF itself. It's a political declaration. I think the reason some people take issue with it is seeing their names vanish from the first few lines of the source file, and be replaced by something they don't agree with, or don't understand. Jo=C3=A3o