From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Philippe Vaucher Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Imports / inclusion of s.el into Emacs Date: Sun, 3 May 2020 16:18:43 +0200 Message-ID: References: <831ro2tqqx.fsf@gnu.org> <4a1fd3f4-df92-c756-9874-4d07b54148ac@yandex.ru> <83v9lesapw.fsf@gnu.org> <83pnbms9m8.fsf@gnu.org> <83a72qs4z2.fsf@gnu.org> <83wo5uqoh5.fsf@gnu.org> <838si9qf7s.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000017bc9e05a4bf1922" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="77319"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Dmitry Gutov , Richard Stallman , =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= , Stefan Monnier , Emacs developers To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun May 03 16:20:31 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFTr-000K2a-Eh for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 16:20:31 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59886 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFTq-00025b-G2 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:20:30 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:36280) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFSc-0008Ny-J7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:19:15 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-lf1-x12d.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::12d]:45143) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFSb-00016x-7C; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:19:14 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-lf1-x12d.google.com with SMTP id a4so1044214lfh.12; Sun, 03 May 2020 07:19:12 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=v8TZ4Yb+0KcHNCr3dIS8Xd8SfSru9QDsRZULmTkKyMU=; b=W+ZPi0cdNpmsqi2lLzdX/B5uTtIveSMOcYtcf1BdHyqu+RvQVIkoXfAKM1/Iiv1/AK OEHQ01zdO6QXT96Cof+7rSgEPC9vIVSyFED2FYvgJWRAFpgPPGhjAxtfqoqNV64RtFYX lePpRaPwjPnl27FXob1VPl3KRX4WwQ1kYo0O5/f+Q9MMiFrtPJbgTDNN6txCwM5GW11Z Hs3gzZUckqQE3nQnrIRyUvBa7eRjYk7ZFQNpSo9VNreblevSjjRY3TvwBBqjKgIngHSj ssXA1Reat7Mdai5h36eDkfVtQH35SDRJIXBgKNkCEkctwopeENGKOGeyXaoqhwDbj3wM si8Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=v8TZ4Yb+0KcHNCr3dIS8Xd8SfSru9QDsRZULmTkKyMU=; b=LzlUi2IDMDt28zm38nE0fSE9IsU/kfqWFqsiMSH1HFk2yxSXDnnkHoq+z57QgBqrBp s1HRlIVZLbgE2oPEsUnEndvFAnV0OaaDRzNaad7AIz0NUuIfn5J/gQDffQ9MgmBI9V3t Gqj9WJZKw8aThmCrTX36vkiYdUlugO8QW5LEWiks8YWl4zy8XSJbECVrE/oCoO3+W+ME S6CkXkVPynKXbg6jJMSA3UwzCEqgtxQ10NZzkNQ4Ak+lKAd0Fbjos9Yg/VAa97O9RpOT STnS8YfvbFJKpZiHnTswIKFMGWhWRYqBdhQ2W+hIjB9pO/8v8VtKvx0uFrecsFwvvoiE Ge3g== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuY5gzf0/UnRASBh6Ex+e4R2wlhp7LlNCEDqa3by1FcSPgQpzE2E YzJh0gClPtd9xZgMtYqE3+THY2P6ljMT4EJGBaJe4n0z X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLbAy23okpbBzEX9FUUGwy4hiLSq4yny6c/3sPIJ6253V5q8WBFyhMVTSVmJggOl4w7U+bDvu4xQ+0wtAoAUGE= X-Received: by 2002:a19:6a10:: with SMTP id u16mr4620385lfu.105.1588515550246; Sun, 03 May 2020 07:19:10 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <838si9qf7s.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::12d; envelope-from=philippe.vaucher@gmail.com; helo=mail-lf1-x12d.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:248688 Archived-At: --00000000000017bc9e05a4bf1922 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > I understand this very well, I'm just astonished to hear that this is > all the documentation you and some others want to see or have. It's > completely against all I have ever learned and practiced in the way of > teaching people various skills and topics (and I did that more than > once or twice). > No this is not what we are saying. Tutorials are not the only documentation I and others want to see. We like to switch between tutorials and full-blown documentation at different times depending on various factors. In Emacs there's only the full-blown documentation. > Emacs has a wealth of documentation at your fingertips, arranged, > indexed, and enriched with a large collection of commands designed to > make our self-documenting editor easy to study. To give up all of > this and insist on having instead a flat list of APIs that match some > textual pattern is something that comes as a shock to me. > We are not giving up on it. Some might but at least not me. Philippe --00000000000017bc9e05a4bf1922 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I understand this very well, I'm just astonished to = hear that this is
all the documentation you and some others want to see or have.=C2=A0 It'= ;s
completely against all I have ever learned and practiced in the way of
teaching people various skills and topics (and I did that more than
once or twice).

No this is not what we = are saying. Tutorials are not the=C2=A0only documentation I and others want= to see.

We like to switch between tutorials and full-blown d= ocumentation at different times depending on various factors. In Emacs ther= e's only the full-blown documentation.

=C2=A0<= /div>
Emacs has a wealth o= f documentation at your fingertips, arranged,
indexed, and enriched with a large collection of commands designed to
make our self-documenting editor easy to study.=C2=A0 To give up all of
this and insist on having instead a flat list of APIs that match some
textual pattern is something that comes as a shock to me.
<= div>
We are not giving up on it. Some might but at least not = me.

Philippe
--00000000000017bc9e05a4bf1922--