From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Kaushal Modi Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Option to not automatically customize-save-variable `package-selected-packages' Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2016 14:05:29 -0500 Message-ID: References: <56C43D17.7010009@alice.it> <831t8aufoe.fsf@gnu.org> <8737sp51vx.fsf@gmail.com> <83fuwpubpn.fsf@gnu.org> <87egc9ahav.fsf@fastmail.fm> <834md5u426.fsf@gnu.org> <87vb5l664f.fsf@fastmail.fm> <83mvqxrqql.fsf@gnu.org> <87y4ag3l7s.fsf@gmail.com> <83si0or96s.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3g8366a.fsf@gmail.com> <83fuwor0u5.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113ce1640539fe052c242d33 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1455908783 18347 80.91.229.3 (19 Feb 2016 19:06:23 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:06:23 +0000 (UTC) Cc: joostkremers@fastmail.fm, John Wiegley , Artur Malabarba , Emacs developers To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Feb 19 20:06:22 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aWqNf-0003lr-Q8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 20:06:20 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54701 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aWqNf-00007u-1b for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 14:06:19 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:41423) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aWqNX-00006W-El for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 14:06:15 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aWqNW-00077Y-95 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 14:06:11 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-oi0-x230.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4003:c06::230]:35585) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aWqNW-00077N-2F; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 14:06:10 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-oi0-x230.google.com with SMTP id x21so18523793oix.2; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 11:06:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=6zYEUS/azaLM7HdeCxHBN61TL2Sb7TQZE0pl0BomoNY=; b=aZT0EryzKhggfCRY5/zML5uwfnQKuyZTmW1m854RGfuIfkXjkrM3nmPq637vg75kZW gjv21lvCBwTO+WV4jB+aO4N5FYFmApugG3uSI0cc+KhhSeRps5vO2ldpWxaue9pdNx79 unE5Qh/JyzkHCcGjyAwA/qjvCokkWNtPRGH+1FbKhEnwPXNyM1pwnAY92UbNhQf92/DV 4kPBeTp7To7UCDPmxtqlSIcBFMJByODnfqFIYjAQ0IVeXTLj/46juriqTGwHQYeYQ68f ORUdzRW6E0a7HoTXuZVJ0Gnqgo71SAjsaM64m33mAiLn1WIeOLIVlqzqbkyMUq15SFUK XdSA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=6zYEUS/azaLM7HdeCxHBN61TL2Sb7TQZE0pl0BomoNY=; b=HCLEqyeGly0VqdUyBXj0E2A+8DP7MoaCurvg9mdFm5juIFdEJExI0oyE747L+Pu94Q rOr0T7wR+sGuTJjNCNbsI4T1aKpm4gO/jVNY3534PMYWMwClP32V18x0+iViHig9PeQK RGc/hHwQEPeyXiq3rb4L6tPbhZJkg78BA4f833Z5g667RKR5aFyWlI66RwfCE+VrMT1Z hJhqChWOVIGd1IqEpboVo8V/QMcw2g1/FR7Wenm2mfjCY4GbKyIAkodRnF1pc7PByrtX +76o7I2h6HOTi147yANXHjF0p1AJfElLaashtIdq7fjPye3KHWnWIVgCYdwHSmN2Q55h GQXA== X-Gm-Message-State: AG10YOQ2QkWskEfQtVVzFJzpz/nFohh6Ds1mfA2WLuubR/H0O9HCy5E7QHQwI2zucDj2DKeHbQp6YkMBAQf6kg== X-Received: by 10.202.177.215 with SMTP id a206mr12706009oif.2.1455908769312; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 11:06:09 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.202.201.73 with HTTP; Fri, 19 Feb 2016 11:05:29 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <83fuwor0u5.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4003:c06::230 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:200238 Archived-At: --001a113ce1640539fe052c242d33 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On Fri, Feb 19, 2016 at 1:50 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > I'd > still like to understand what's so special about this particular > customization. > IMO this particular customization is not portable across multiple machines. All machines need not have the same packages installed; reasons: different emacs versions, one machine begin at work, another at home, etc. Another reason is that this variable is more like persistent data cache which updates very frequently (unlike the other customization options which a user typically sets and does "Save for future sessions"). In the former case, user has no control on what this variable is set to; in the latter case, user has total control. Also the value stored in this variable is more of use to package.el than directly to the user. The train of thought is that user doesn't care what this variable is set to. But a user would care if delete-selection-mode is set to nil/t. Also frequent changing of this variable value causes noise in git commits (if a user is saving their config using git); the diff of this variable change is not very helpful as usually people have lots of packages installed and a glance at the diff doesn't tell instantly which package was added/removed. In crux, committing of custom-file causes non-useful commits. That brings back to the earlier point that as this variable is machine-specific, they do not need to be in a file which a user would typically share among machines. If I am used to delete-selection-mode on one machine, that stays true when I am using emacs on my other machine too. -- Kaushal Modi --001a113ce1640539fe052c242d33 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

= On Fri, Feb 19, 2016 at 1:50 PM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wro= te:
I'd
still like to understand what's so special about this particular
customization.

IMO this particular customizatio= n is not portable across multiple machines. All machines need not have the = same packages installed; reasons: different emacs versions, one machine beg= in at work, another at home, etc.

Another reason is that this variable is more li= ke persistent data cache which updates very frequently (unlike the other cu= stomization options which a user typically sets and does "Save for fut= ure sessions"). In the former case, user has no control on what this v= ariable is set to; in the latter case, user has total control.

Also the value sto= red in this variable is more of use to package.el than directly to the user= . The train of thought is that user doesn't care what this variable is = set to. But a user would care if delete-selection-mode is set to nil/t.

Also freq= uent changing of this variable value causes noise in git commits (if a user= is saving their config using git); the diff of this variable change is not= very helpful as usually people have lots of packages installed and a glanc= e at the diff doesn't tell instantly which package was added/removed. I= n crux, committing of custom-file causes non-useful commits. That brings ba= ck to the earlier point that as this variable is machine-specific, they do = not need to be in a file which a user would typically share among machines.= If I am used to delete-selection-mode on one machine, that stays true when= I am using emacs on my other machine too.


--
Kaushal Modi
--001a113ce1640539fe052c242d33--