From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Thibaut Verron Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Opening Up More Keymaps Re: Standardizing more key bindings? Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2020 12:38:40 +0200 Message-ID: References: <24436.53239.437810.270641@retriever.mtv.corp.google.com> <24436.58187.698211.262192@retriever.mtv.corp.google.com> <83362yisgn.fsf@gnu.org> <83y2kpf74o.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: thibaut.verron@gmail.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c9814a05b0d5f856" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="14310"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , raman@google.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, Dmitry Gutov To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Oct 04 12:39:31 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kP1QR-0003d6-7H for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2020 12:39:31 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58604 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kP1QQ-0002RQ-7B for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2020 06:39:30 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45138) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kP1Ps-00020X-Lo for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2020 06:38:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wr1-x42f.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42f]:46020) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kP1Pr-0000qI-4U; Sun, 04 Oct 2020 06:38:56 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wr1-x42f.google.com with SMTP id x14so6393216wrl.12; Sun, 04 Oct 2020 03:38:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=4oraQZvrhR9Idk1s7ihknQ8zDaaPhcCNI+cdbd7b53w=; b=WlT/TSjACsMOMR7Tq3IhD48NtAA2ScqDGVWl1/Ya2leLeo9WK3jB73ytaU8NHAeSUY npvo9sxX7R2bDz3QxRqVyHjDp0YbQgHnXt7Nvbuu36TWm42GMoOk7R4z54cPHkG5lfNg Sffd5FC4tGZPLevs0qX/BdIfattNOWCMce2DApAPsx2LxLxnvZvN9aFWAT779hfGCxwd EaaVF6lt9pnJ2h16Y9tv3asDsjzAlQONDITaPCe+Ap8aRFN8D/0Ms/qUNzR8n8e8UHpD Us3Px7gAcjg7jrx9OwFZY3k0J6FKjSyCste2ciONUf1HNlKz7aBXJ5TR8I9cMUAvj1YZ 0yMA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4oraQZvrhR9Idk1s7ihknQ8zDaaPhcCNI+cdbd7b53w=; b=I2PPn8CLerZEinmlHbsjGzJLoqmE0zQ0XluawmSAMnzTJMTb230b826RCZ4tXBj0YW f0gIppSU9mJ9prma+O6ba95CsHqbLgFtvlg4ylTCmCKwb2FmLVV3s2DypIy3w3LB1r7i Uml09hMxGkF590UObz9HPDeUoCvwMBM/Kp5ZwtYXSAgKeQYsu5dMAhRYko/buEgMHwBc NzDWdNvZdEnoyccfdLAyLH+evTDstitN1NZmfwaJBPVUsj7NCrPlY1dwIOfBRSYMyY30 6I4eODN8024HpplwEGczt7ewNQhZwix2DQTsaZxIrYFcS1PR1T8nc4KUo38hBKNaQCR5 8/4w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532szF9zso+kjPvmN1AJfeaxSuBksvrNlAmk/kSEna5di61VT4c9 nb55iAaUM+Fq+MkFlnN2U+0NTGTfpi8eqWnle/3Zy/lUgIk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzua9Pp4gstO6b8gGd4WX43rbZMpuy46ooRwF7w/xwC+GMjvDP/sCJJ0sfCwiIZ8U5xOpMz20C4HwwMFlxSSSE= X-Received: by 2002:adf:bbc6:: with SMTP id z6mr1118762wrg.298.1601807932030; Sun, 04 Oct 2020 03:38:52 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42f; envelope-from=thibaut.verron@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42f.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:257023 Archived-At: --000000000000c9814a05b0d5f856 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Le dim. 4 oct. 2020 =C3=A0 05:38, Richard Stallman a =C3=A9cr= it : > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > > I understand. However, suspending Emacs is a very infrequent > > operation these days, what with most everyone working in a windowed > > environment. > > It is not "very" infrequent, when running Emacs on a tty. It is > somewhat infrequent. It wouldn't bother me to type the character > twice on those occasions. > > However, C-z and C-c are the standard ways to get out of a program, > and if neither of them works, people will get trapped in it. > > If C-z C-z is the way to suspend, and the first C-z (when it echoes) > displays a message such as "To suspend Emacs, type C-z again now", > I think that will enable people to get out. > > C-x C-z is not adequate for this. > The exact same arguments could apply to C-c being "replaced" by C-x C-c. --000000000000c9814a05b0d5f856 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Le dim. 4 oct. 2020 =C3=A0 05:38, Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0:
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email= : please consider=C2=A0 =C2=A0 ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies,=C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]<= br>
=C2=A0 > I understand.=C2=A0 However, suspending Emacs is a very infrequ= ent
=C2=A0 > operation these days, what with most everyone working in a wind= owed
=C2=A0 > environment.

It is not "very" infrequent, when running Emacs on a tty.=C2=A0 I= t is
somewhat infrequent.=C2=A0 It wouldn't bother me to type the character<= br> twice on those occasions.

However, C-z and C-c are the standard ways to get out of a program,
and if neither of them works, people will get trapped in it.

If C-z C-z is the way to suspend, and the first C-z (when it echoes)
displays a message such as "To suspend Emacs, type C-z again now"= ,
I think that will enable people to get out.

C-x C-z is not adequate for this.

The exact same arguments could apply to C-= c being "replaced" by C-x C-c.=C2=A0
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