From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: "Why is emacs so square?" Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2020 06:39:52 +0200 Message-ID: References: <8wXYP4GY9hwW-9mYv6_LGMETZ8Vz3Ob1Bec6yh6kPT7yxjTkxA3V6dXY4ELra9tYiJUxJmgXKSIEX4w8HFiPRoeGVSQHDSoBVy1voj1e3Qo=@protonmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="94429"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Emacs developers , ndame To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 15 06:40:41 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jOZqr-000OTG-Ii for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 15 Apr 2020 06:40:41 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42856 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jOZqq-0002TS-E5 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 15 Apr 2020 00:40:40 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:54058) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jOZqL-0001yO-K8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 15 Apr 2020 00:40:10 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1jOZqK-0005vQ-KB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 15 Apr 2020 00:40:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-yb1-f174.google.com ([209.85.219.174]:37097) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1jOZqJ-0005rY-4Q; Wed, 15 Apr 2020 00:40:07 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-yb1-f174.google.com with SMTP id n2so8473263ybg.4; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 21:40:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/Qg6d5To5/7eL8BiR5e4ridHfk2mKWIfIPB/icd46HI=; b=Noql4+qovzjULh1VRrJofxejOBUGyrWyD6x9pZTP1hxvUq8Wazo4e6ckqPULn+3ghU g3v5AsjBq/tYaZGLD/rhWNlO56kml8yffLahtVIH05pEnnUXqbVCy0Ny9yzsVPJ1X58V 4WckKO42unZI1mkE+HwAAxbYd9PmMSFk5DSzOrpuuFGmSZ1mpp5iAqelAJ4w02aN7iJ9 PE7HP+W1t52NjmxkmU99vKPj6HdBGvb9Rn6uJ58rDs3uE/9yUvyewM/SGfP0LfDcILyh 2NaCjnasSu+KrUdV3H8smDonrMGjU+z1HfAxLE4lLduO+E71RXSU5S8WFkYjWnMPOMOe JXgg== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuarkqGpZtoy9MhTQEa5J3TCPHVwIlGgd1BWivS4lFa485yk2Piu gmBC9uW3NOVqmLHAluuBh1oqOpse/uNfSkUYFYs78I3LUmE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypJemtwH2mOXGVCI74X4G1LGJq4zQ8yhOHak6uO9xxztJ19Emmiki5S1GeRPmsbTZ21TvjgS37DusHe1N6qUtCw= X-Received: by 2002:a25:bec2:: with SMTP id k2mr5586053ybm.129.1586925603606; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 21:40:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 209.85.219.174 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:246982 Archived-At: Richard Stallman writes: > Perhaps we should implement a mode that puts cosmetics on Emacs Is there any reason not to improve the default look? > so it will appeal to those who judge by the surface of things. I think it's unfortunate if we assume that this is all bells and whistles. Graphical design elements can also improve usability. I also don't know that it's helpful to assume that the rest of the world will take the enlightened stance. For example, I've always assumed that many people use Sublime Text not due to any serious feature comparison with Emacs, but because they like its "sleek look". I don't suggest that we should imitate proprietary junk editor , but we should realize that these things are not wholly unimportant. Best regards, Stefan Kangas