From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [PATCH] hack-one-local-variable use lexical-binding Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2020 03:43:04 -0600 Message-ID: References: <8E2B73D4-1269-4D0A-B572-7B6B47C46924@gnu.org> <83blfkqisb.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="32573"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: tgbugs@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii , Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Nov 29 10:44:05 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kjJFV-0008PH-D6 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 10:44:05 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:60004 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kjJFU-0000Oo-Du for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 04:44:04 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38776) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kjJEa-0007yw-KM for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 04:43:08 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-pf1-x444.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::444]:33908) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kjJEY-0005hd-So; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 04:43:08 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-pf1-x444.google.com with SMTP id w6so8326900pfu.1; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 01:43:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=a/WgpPptq+UGpUNFkqst7isjQWRWm89LNGKDSvR2iC0=; b=mt3SRr4utn99Cbt5gAy61CZy9gGLYlyBdjwMtiqU5LZS04a1VOUz7I2gEssQrC1/uV hD5H4waVrfCENI8++kxT8SZVAJfuDjzdv/iaRKNG/WTvz2HtWtBTo7+KPBSBlIH6/1o5 QIgxNRZ7dAp6OcPRYLj7xwIYulUoLARLPsMrMYpDVOWAtLbfSgv/JSrCPwnIHzo9oROk WJvPFPDgaCQCPzXIvCFo6usG9WpmysmsNwWFf6r5eg+mPHT7fTcnTMPa9bQLAUADiZC3 IqR+qNOUQcHx/PMXL3gZ7p3EfsYKq7iPX5xWlHXGt3Q36oLhw4PcOCk6ouhBUGd8pDjd bJvw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=a/WgpPptq+UGpUNFkqst7isjQWRWm89LNGKDSvR2iC0=; b=Za9XH4MSRMFTLJ41f4PAFVd7ZhJMj/UV1gI5FrnHJ1mGZv9EqgN/m1kyhDy03urxkX LOqFiT4XLAsuNpHfv0lxN10i2Lk1XkJWfS6nyy8j9Co9AsMhb9+URDJELweZIRZi8Wpn le5ujuvsbSe2BmGYHvKKnluBunn5llfJWakvlVK+3hJOKxv1P+gC5SAwErQ86xS6R7qu ZG9qjN1QYSTbG9oCXVPpzosgsTUQDE5w6AGGh6+8mLEaWEJQc/pj5M+gMCh30THgRcLj 328R3oftYST8bOUA5wlV5IvchEnBh9empquK+4zz1XPuCyXUCnu0U+Q4p4fiNNnDrlfX Hg6g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532d6MsoeEAOHkypd+eG5uvBO/njoJH4tdvXXVs56hUQWpO1A/SN RVrN0Ans+lwTZJ2CtosRl/JwTGDNrhfe4TShNd3xwCEm X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJys6HqAv/XLHti76AZlmmHdBt9ucU9flpTdb+RAb+RXRH4+VNAjvWhb4SXIAlgP9tuZ7+FewcF1nYCbJh6FJfE= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:a090:: with SMTP id r16mr20323747pjp.179.1606642984845; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 01:43:04 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 03:43:04 -0600 In-Reply-To: <83blfkqisb.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::444; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-pf1-x444.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:259997 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Stefan Monnier >> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, Tom Gillespie >> Date: Thu, 26 Nov 2020 09:21:22 -0500 >> >> > This would be a backward-incompatible change, wouldn't it? >> >> I've made exactly this kind of incompatible change many times over >> between Emacs-24 and now. I don't think we should worry about it. >> >> > I'd prefer a backward compatible solution. For example, how about >> > a separate lexical-eval clause, which will do this leaving eval to >> > work as it did before? >> >> As I said, that's over-engineering. > > We disagree. Once we use lexical-binding t by default in all other cases, it would be surprising for it to default to nil in this case. For me, the most important thing is therefore to have a clear idea how we can make file local `eval' use lexical-binding by default at some point in the future. If Eli insists that we can't make this backwards incompatible change now, I would suggest instead to introduce `non-lexical-eval' or `dynamic-eval' and document that any use of plain `eval' that relies on lexical-binding nil is now deprecated. In a future version, we can then make the proposed backwards incompatible change, once users have had sufficient time to switch to `dynamic-eval'. This change could be made, for example, when we switch to use lexical-binding by default in .el files. (We could also provide `lexical-eval', if we want to.)