From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Opening Up More Keymaps Re: Standardizing more key bindings? Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2020 07:17:26 -0700 Message-ID: References: <24436.53239.437810.270641@retriever.mtv.corp.google.com> <24436.58187.698211.262192@retriever.mtv.corp.google.com> <83362yisgn.fsf@gnu.org> <20201001123812.sdfy6t3eqbecv733@Ergus> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="7294"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: dgutov@yandex.ru, raman@google.com, Stefan Monnier , thibaut.verron@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ergus , Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 01 16:19:02 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kNzQD-0001ko-Lv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2020 16:19:01 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43932 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kNzQC-0003CC-Mu for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2020 10:19:00 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34414) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kNzOl-0002RV-Nm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2020 10:17:31 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ej1-x632.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::632]:45404) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kNzOj-00079Q-Iv; Thu, 01 Oct 2020 10:17:31 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-ej1-x632.google.com with SMTP id i26so8297263ejb.12; Thu, 01 Oct 2020 07:17:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=vuMKGOfL8bZASnUGgOcYbYIvq4YCyyHLkkI9J1mAbM8=; b=cg6yEoEVWvaoOSURU9ssC2a/FPfE8Q1QQNsPOjiLyJdIH5NUUHhSqXN/zZL5/BkU7n y7EulQHZsOmkyo503m0rCvYIJBULgko7jdjuOuABCqIZLkLEI9TL0evCeCkrxqXsQChk Dci/YoxKT5cMnY0MdMjDdqex1R4SYDVoYzu3SRo6WPX6iwWSjA71IBOVozygDVgTBUEn t6fuLkKc/SW8ODuw71s2GkFLNZlQ+eI03Qr2F9UF1s/bwg4lrhSeUJe8zCbX126EoqgW MNY3zpA1znmoRMFRI6qJDuARPZ3ZFfGzzoPKMnf6bKf1MfIIL94JVdTQOYlCk5Gg5CMA kQBA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=vuMKGOfL8bZASnUGgOcYbYIvq4YCyyHLkkI9J1mAbM8=; b=j79ISpqAtFSSpExUS8GN4kB/3LJQf49/jWBnj/P7Q3PbpqdZi5if2eql1IhZGtIqWR hqgD+XcVxtURevDer/GVMf25SouybPXCl7pfUlXQ9gFDaUmqHgqkKy0JUPBRG/tW1sA8 sHnjuta7AGOf0H1hOqIKIBHW6s/LGdGSAmZZjTzGzK0qrFl3GiL0I4NQjkzLChD8zsYv TXN8lIrITgIejmJ2MNjY1yZuBYt27Lc6zkE2gMn02opJHy2FkCkhk/HcEwIFp0awM9+U wCfT+XkeSjf2/+xCMSAu+2mqBewxdy0fC9VeIly2YqCrf1mdLPkIeL0qDQys7+B3F5bc 5g4w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531IbtF+gxF/Nlm0wJvQUU/Kn0fVVEJ/Pvr9QqCRVGCjcOuNPyyI 9URr9hAn8jH2Qbdv4NejVtTyu+BSbs9JXbc3P6Q= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyf9cozm1IJKgHGgae1Tf1jz2Yaw1uY6Qtc24ZoxWgQfKurFBNbAKknhZbklCrKZljDXSECJhKNaNdVfSezmoU= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:11d2:: with SMTP id o18mr8181154eja.420.1601561847595; Thu, 01 Oct 2020 07:17:27 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Thu, 1 Oct 2020 07:17:26 -0700 In-Reply-To: <20201001123812.sdfy6t3eqbecv733@Ergus> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::632; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-ej1-x632.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:256846 Archived-At: Ergus writes: > For new users they have more C-z as undo in their muscular memory... so > I have experienced that they get very confused when C-z makes the window > disappear or closes emacs. Some of them think that emacs just failed and > open a new one. There is a trade-off between being weird to hard core terminal users in this case, and being weird to the rest of the world. IMO, undo is by far the best default for C-z. > About F2 I don't really think will bother many people as there is an > alternative `C-x 6` since ever. Fully agreed.