From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: [External] : Proposal for an improved `help-for-help' Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2021 11:31:16 -0600 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22880"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" To: Drew Adams , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Feb 21 18:33:34 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lDsbu-0005q2-3S for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 18:33:34 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:45342 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lDsbt-0000Ph-1v for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 12:33:33 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:35364) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lDsZk-0007VF-4Q for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 12:31:20 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-pg1-f180.google.com ([209.85.215.180]:40617) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lDsZi-0006rc-GP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 12:31:19 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-pg1-f180.google.com with SMTP id b21so8615574pgk.7 for ; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 09:31:18 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=LvqGRSxZB8g+MPgJq+QPY0JPDVGDq0i+lj+nioCOY2c=; b=Opc+Cd6EfWgyC79qqlFUgqNW82Ge5nMeNsWdePnpkwF7WB7DdeAAimlkKVowvw9Deu G/73+AtldLwhzuUuzLV8ex8PouQJ+0h2IhGeAPjCFYgpBHVv6tyrDpNQLXqJi8PvN02j nsvYkEcTgqfxczz5WzEOMiuCQQUfI5zJSPpBIdEubZIGkIslL15HTgl0DPJ8eD+7sNIK ZrVt9uFa+icOzFSjtzfJmuWWmB5+KXUKQsbgKoNz4ZlReiUutsE7hYSnvyWqIfVhBiXx SZBi/dZreV1h9X3ZBZZfICdT6d3FRE/Lu4bWXMYCSOt3VR27M5r5K0FZ8nZNmJCGV2vB Zd1g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5308hPWNPmyxpGQ1gLHBnERbkdyEGp9UKga1AwmV4VE+yxmWqDTv LxM1RSm/oU9GmxiBZch6WC//qoLhI1tV7Cnlfec= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJybFMslGku1UIr7t5FxVeXLmYbqOBX6xvsqKg+eKKjD8BGVzbKdhzz7/E7rkwrhKhTtjGecVnUZ9MQ50zp6Yaw= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:8384:0:b029:1ed:1317:fbe4 with SMTP id u4-20020aa783840000b02901ed1317fbe4mr16221666pfm.57.1613928676900; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 09:31:16 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 11:31:16 -0600 In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=209.85.215.180; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-f180.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -13 X-Spam_score: -1.4 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:265410 Archived-At: Drew Adams writes: > FWIW, I've never been a big fan of the help-for-help UI. > > At a minimum, keys and commands mentioned should > have links to their full doc (or other info). I don't see the need for such links in `help-for-help' in particular, but I'm open to being convinced. It might make sense if we can find a good UI that is easy to understand and does not overwhelm. What do you imagine this would look like? For example, which keys would a user press after `C-h C-h' to follow these added links? (This might also be outside the scope of the reformatting I attempt here.)