From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Radon Rosborough Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Summary and next steps for (package-initialize) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2017 17:54:45 -0700 Message-ID: References: <42c93165-2d85-8501-9cc8-99830b7b3646@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1142b346b1e19605577548aa" X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1503536184 3939 195.159.176.226 (24 Aug 2017 00:56:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2017 00:56:24 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Nikolay Kudryavtsev , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Nathan Moreau Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 24 02:56:20 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dkgRU-0000bc-5x for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 02:56:16 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46227 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkgRa-0007xg-Vx for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 20:56:23 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:58874) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkgQi-0007wn-NK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 20:55:29 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkgQh-0003d9-Iy for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 20:55:28 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-lf0-x233.google.com ([2a00:1450:4010:c07::233]:37687) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkgQh-0003am-BB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 20:55:27 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-lf0-x233.google.com with SMTP id z130so2487058lff.4 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 17:55:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4X2x6Exx7ba8YTzXG1YCb/5qFZxA/PNzjZbEkAPE+Dk=; b=W2hIOFiMR4v+b8nu0KjJiigSkgl36Sm9a6TUqM/bUgu067NDZ39LkPo4dm0jMUPf2u 8lzgIIRBEJABr19/CAFW/v/mHkU/R9wByCxAOmFtFSbxgi1Qprv/ySDKVBfZnN8GfmZk Ws0UZxLy2UQWaPdKzsqdKtnZU8usT2ebBR81kIAO4p8Nyn/ywN8o/wG2GZp7UTqe7m97 YwkxgbXIq29LjKeeLlDB1m1EElz9jIfDj8lhTR/HcqgcjArVKmf/ZrBPMH41emxFHock XR/m2lZVF+8imwlnhcl6ERqVyb1rXfY7ciNINc+qocU7c1AcWsbyCKjefxgZsx+0InrG sGaw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4X2x6Exx7ba8YTzXG1YCb/5qFZxA/PNzjZbEkAPE+Dk=; b=LsYWH7z4KziUXchl2Irt/SC1mGnz6lihBdvFckqa8a77go31dWmPtLkJ0GlIgHp5RP DAZceqrTjmnU7Pjk9R1Ps+abFV0+RWUkKzEnrIHNMtONRYvyxdsun/4Sha6NQrhxOQsZ +MzHzQbHpdNy54kPYJSIOvcBBRixkXdB6bjnrL0kMoE38VOtI5qw6w/5Bb0t05wq0T/e K/FSw65+qh0Dce3FqMxsDduRmtYX/uBqlFdfS0N78Eh8LQW/A1CFCWayYSz4B0fmQTu8 nohCwZW09uHkr7e2SC4JLUqaq19MeLgjf/ccwaDle+VG+syFkg5JUO2M7h+obUdchtrz Pxcg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHYfb5iFM+e3Oqi+xKvEO2XsArQLofAroeYDXo1NVP2vtFPj4eTJdjmc n412EolX4ebD0s28/6D0fZLHpUXUGA== X-Received: by 10.46.0.196 with SMTP id e65mr1649884lji.191.1503536125958; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 17:55:25 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.25.42.215 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Aug 2017 17:54:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:4010:c07::233 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:217749 Archived-At: --001a1142b346b1e19605577548aa Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > - and makes users that don't want package.el happy: they don't need > to put anything related to it in their configuration code, and the > its code is unloaded as long as their configuration loads cleanly. Can you explain what you mean by "its code is unloaded"? > as long as their configuration loads cleanly I worry that having any error trigger lots of package.el code, filesystem calls, and arbitrary third-party Lisp code downloaded from the Internet will make debugging more... "fun". Also, if we don't have a popup, then how would the user end up in the state where they have `package-initialize' in their init-file? Would we just keep on running `package-initialize' at the first undefined function error on every init? That seems... slightly hacky, to say the least. --001a1142b346b1e19605577548aa Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> - and makes users that don't want package.el= happy: they don't need
> =C2=A0 to put anything related t= o it in their configuration code, and the
> =C2=A0 its code is= unloaded as long as their configuration loads cleanly.

Can you explain what you mean by "its code is unloaded"?

> as long as their configuration loads cleanly

I worry that having any error trigger lots of packag= e.el code,
filesystem calls, and arbitrary third-party Lisp code = downloaded from
the Internet will make debugging more... "fu= n".

Also, if we don't have a popup, then = how would the user end up in the
state where they have `package-i= nitialize' in their init-file? Would
we just keep on running = `package-initialize' at the first undefined
function error on= every init? That seems... slightly hacky, to say the
least.

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