From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tim Cross Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Theme generator (was: solarized) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 11:49:04 +1000 Message-ID: References: <87mu1ra1ej.fsf@protesilaos.com> <87imcf9wfp.fsf@protesilaos.com> <986EE32C-55D8-4A39-B556-872A5F49448E@thornhill.no> <31d12210-1b36-4306-8f79-43f6b4549a9d@www.fastmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009ea9db05af647944" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="39854"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Gerry Agbobada , "Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions." To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 16 03:49:52 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kIMa0-000AG9-4r for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:49:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59706 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kIMZz-0007Ly-65 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 21:49:51 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41420) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kIMZS-0006w9-LL for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 21:49:18 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-oo1-xc2d.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2d]:41637) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kIMZQ-00012Z-OP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 21:49:18 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-oo1-xc2d.google.com with SMTP id t3so1267958ook.8 for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 18:49:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=16j8cz8h1xcp1bmeykwGphE4/qQ/xXKjc9oG8jRHR3M=; b=ReNxG/iuyBtdRjCP/my6vXHQ030nuko/L5CFmgqgCvUZlL7VeOgqCVA762OhyfEaZA 6PDr8qxBSyUUd6w+B9zRyp9h+cBOCUG1YSbYQ1fV5gWua8WhW6033xnu+aDYhtl8FbQT PaWsIffnT8gOGP575HS6MhcjwNru57bZRcrYaIZU+SUrzP/jFaOkxnbecQQK+544K5Iw lBF8v+bPtdAu29Xgdq7Lj+K6dbGBlbxOWZSt1vA6UB4uiZJofPZWzunK1ZCKRCsrYETC RIlbd8n0zxBKMIXFCzG+YK8+laadQIBxfEsOVS5I6obAl02LX3wHfENQi7Qb8yQ4l5/c Ir2A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=16j8cz8h1xcp1bmeykwGphE4/qQ/xXKjc9oG8jRHR3M=; b=ZnM1B5oGTKqRzcTZ8EZqDi9p+RraxfaR4wOCb8cTnjx7V99aSWk1IL9sKHyQrgaPEf hX5meuN0/hPeho1gs1iLTEF7H6HyvKcP5k87tpJP+O1yjW6SAyWhEGJUpvjVD/rq1NFK YfkCJAon4/V5jWcZcB5W8R++x4mccKBmX7uhAUdH9HJWiUc2f/VnZZRxkVtfad5cn19H fzlFvL2wvDIlvSG2MV4mpTIoAL3H7ArC61wOw4Aye02UEZhTvISifItvsaMhfcbB9U6K fWaeWZUcTyDkfe0T/p+beAhUfj/zsh1p7gofxsaajdly4F+YUYH+UVnHbnh3ecn0iV99 tD2A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530WkyBK0nO6pqcgAGlWqawl1t45sgy3h1/7q/GWzUzDBS4/TjU6 Aw46kNCgymCYZ5YTI+H8aFnUwGejDtJwWIjU4RQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxFB4rxjjmozM2lyrj9UVl2cyWeTnvC51+UE1B+MgYpWM3A67tANPuzLy36c3yWzd5nGmeGS5uG/sKgN7/HFak= X-Received: by 2002:a4a:c909:: with SMTP id v9mr16101645ooq.43.1600220955583; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 18:49:15 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2d; envelope-from=theophilusx@gmail.com; helo=mail-oo1-xc2d.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:255813 Archived-At: --0000000000009ea9db05af647944 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I think this is a better approach than trying to come up with a definitive set of themes. The 'look' of your editor is a pretty personal preference and we are unlikely to find a definitive set of themes that will suit all. On the other hand, if we can make it easier to define a theme, we are enabling people to make it look the way they want, which seems to be part of the core essence of Emacs - do it your way. At present, while you have all the power to customize faces, it isn't necessary easy to get things consistent. Defining a new theme usually takes a lot of trial and error. It has certainly improved since I first started with Emacs in the 90s, but could probably be improved further with a theme generator. The big challenge is that Emacs has far more 'faces' than other editors and it sin't always clear how all these faces interact. Some sort of theme generator which could help with this would make it easier for people to define their own themes. The spacemacs setup also has a pretty straight-forward way to tweak existing themes with their theming-modifications list, which makes it easy to tweak specific settings for specific themes (and ensures they are applied when themes change or are re-loaded etc). On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 at 00:43, Stefan Monnier wrote: > > Henrik tried to do it with emacs-doom-themes > > ( https://github.com/hlissner/emacs-doom-themes ) but apparently the > theme > > generation part is not really good and he has been trying to find time to > > rewrite that part. But using that API to define a theme seems really > easy : > > > https://github.com/hlissner/emacs-doom-themes/blob/master/themes/doom-one-theme.el > > > > I think this is the kind of helpers that would warrant upstream > integration : > > Indeed, it seems that if we extended the `defface` machinery to allow > evaluation of Elisp code, we could make this "standard". > > > Stefan > > > -- regards, Tim -- Tim Cross --0000000000009ea9db05af647944 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I think this is a better approach than trying to come up w= ith a definitive set of themes. The 'look' of your editor is a pret= ty personal preference and we are unlikely to find a definitive set of them= es that will suit all. On the other hand, if we can make it easier to defin= e a theme, we are enabling people to make it look the way they want, which = seems to be part of the core essence of Emacs - do it your way.=C2=A0
<= br>
At present, while you have all the power to customize faces, = it isn't necessary easy to get things consistent. Defining a new theme = usually takes a lot of trial and error. It has certainly improved since I f= irst started with Emacs in the 90s, but could probably be improved further = with a theme generator. The big challenge is that Emacs has far more 'f= aces' than other editors and it sin't always clear how all these fa= ces interact. Some sort of theme generator which could help with this would= make it easier for people to define their own themes.=C2=A0

=
The spacemacs setup also has a pretty straight-forward way to tw= eak existing themes with their theming-modifications list, which makes it e= asy to tweak specific settings for specific themes (and ensures they are ap= plied when themes change or are re-loaded etc).


On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 at 00:43, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
=
> Henrik tried to do i= t with emacs-doom-themes
> ( https://github.com/hlissner/emacs-doom-themes ) but apparently the theme
> generation part is not really good and he has been trying to find time= to
> rewrite that part. But using that API to define a theme seems really e= asy :
> https://githu= b.com/hlissner/emacs-doom-themes/blob/master/themes/doom-one-theme.el >
> I think this is the kind of helpers that would warrant upstream integr= ation :

Indeed, it seems that if we extended the `defface` machinery to allow
evaluation of Elisp code, we could make this "standard".


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Stefan




--
regards,

Tim

--
Tim Cross

--0000000000009ea9db05af647944--