From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Philipp Stephani Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [Emacs-diffs] master 61f8c23 1/2: Minor advice.el fix Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2016 12:20:55 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20161212202151.21054.37035@vcs.savannah.gnu.org> <20161212202152.428192201BB@vcs.savannah.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7bb040508809cb0544526b3f X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1482495714 6365 195.159.176.226 (23 Dec 2016 12:21:54 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2016 12:21:54 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Dec 23 13:21:50 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1cKOr2-0000RF-14 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 13:21:44 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38805 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cKOr6-0005aQ-Mb for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 07:21:48 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:60026) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cKOqR-0005aJ-OK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 07:21:08 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cKOqQ-0002rL-Pe for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 07:21:07 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-wj0-x22a.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c01::22a]:36166) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cKOqQ-0002qM-KT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 07:21:06 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-wj0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id c11so46033280wjx.3 for ; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 04:21:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=NxiqjuI1zxOl2CZ2odmdi6/EzmxZttxLAnpPp9WwRHM=; b=VZpftkAnxPbugmnTrx0ghfq0YzwYfJqG1K9PkZ6wQTpAdPIBJaDh3ZSKczhEFN5JkF OLq+7HO1qFvQQcQWt4aDpf4D8nIjaJlUopFVsPacc1Z0uNlcL60E7oyAMfZA5j+6Ydpw vN2Ln7vnQdujSu4eRIpyW5OGpBQTt71xKErsbNANFq9jvuIMxVFwPCIn1UTrI4YlnG+a FiinLhCNE18Xrb65olZVJJyPixD+0BSYlJW47mRQR/zCPXKc5J4LKSx1Rhci9zunQnEI eg9gjAGXw2SWWPXA7xYrXCFZJYIlXElbybIfL2b1LZSLxHOofho9Yq2nKL7yQWPwxbna 2T5g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=NxiqjuI1zxOl2CZ2odmdi6/EzmxZttxLAnpPp9WwRHM=; b=nPGfvxG3Xcxn6j4h4y2fMaU/09+aAZLyYQuJiNDwy6Cfrm2GPlK8fTJxSdeB1rRRbC g87cPrRMwTkS4VxKn3HDX4PHxZo5W8/8thTsURSOuN7XFqdx+DESzNcboR4/lj1uRn+z DnJ/BZ33mk7MS96Y7qfpF1HCdCcpV+TUnrZgSbPOnP+E2PuhYsPG0dmsLtKDx8dkXEGC EKvfMtzg7WAJgMRE7q03iaT78yz/QoMUA3Qh4KGL2FoWxGZx6a7ojZFsnDrTd7PrInq6 IAR15KIQshrdO9geqp2aS/3HmnDg7SMgpRBEPGOH06vpOwvwJYE1Ns95RV3Kvg9xIh/n pqjw== X-Gm-Message-State: AIkVDXICwbHxbkP4oO4Yn3pcOVEWYKM1T2yxvQK/Yt8J7jil3RpqOlVUNDWXfAKLHegTK7wfDDsszNt/97233g== X-Received: by 10.194.95.35 with SMTP id dh3mr14301979wjb.141.1482495665635; Fri, 23 Dec 2016 04:21:05 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c01::22a X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:210750 Archived-At: --047d7bb040508809cb0544526b3f Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Stefan Monnier schrieb am So., 18. Dez. 2016 um 21:15 Uhr: > > For some of them definitely. I'd draw the line between pure functions > like > > car and eq, where those facilities never make sense and would be > > ineffective anyway as the functions are compiled away or called directly, > > and impure functions like call-process, where fset is necessary for > > mocking. As a rule of thumb, I'd suggest to ban fset on all symbols that > > have a byte-code equivalent, and on constant symbols. > > I still very doubt that the potential benefit is worth the added cost > (more specifically, as a maintainer I would strongly oppose such > measure). Why is then the potential benefit for the value cells worth the added cost, i.e. why not also allow (set t 5)? > Are you also going to try and prevent the user from using all > the other ways he can shoot himself in the foot? > > To the extent that it's feasible, yes. Emacs Lisp isn't C. If the user wants to shoot themselves in the foot, they can write a C module. --047d7bb040508809cb0544526b3f Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Stefan= Monnier <monnier@iro.umontr= eal.ca> schrieb am So., 18. Dez. 2016 um 21:15=C2=A0Uhr:
> For some of them definitely. I'd draw= the line between pure functions like
> car and eq, where those facilities never make sense and would be
> ineffective anyway as the functions are compiled away or called direct= ly,
> and impure functions like call-process, where fset is necessary for > mocking. As a rule of thumb, I'd suggest to ban fset on all symbol= s that
> have a byte-code equivalent, and on constant symbols.

I still very doubt that the potential benefit is worth the added cost
(more specifically, as a maintainer I would strongly oppose such
measure).=C2=A0

Why is then the potential b= enefit for the value cells worth the added cost, i.e. why not also allow (s= et t 5)?
=C2=A0
Are you also= going to try and prevent the user from using all
the other ways he can shoot himself in the foot?


To the extent that= it's feasible, yes. Emacs Lisp isn't C. If the user wants to shoot= themselves in the foot, they can write a C module.=C2=A0
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