From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Robert Weiner Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs bug #23794; sort-line behavior regressed from prior Emacs versions Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:50:23 -0400 Message-ID: References: <83shwa9zmr.fsf@gnu.org> <83lh229ywc.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: rswgnu@gmail.com NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113d148cc0efd40535911cb9 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1466272275 10378 80.91.229.3 (18 Jun 2016 17:51:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2016 17:51:15 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Richard Stallman , emacs-devel To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jun 18 19:51:15 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKOo-0007Vi-Ml for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 19:51:14 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35893 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKOo-0003hQ-3s for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:51:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:50673) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKOi-0003gT-ML for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:51:09 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKOc-0001Va-Nl for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:51:07 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:36875) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKOc-0001VW-Jt for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:51:02 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-oi0-f54.google.com ([209.85.218.54]:35648) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKOT-0000Wa-Ad; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:50:53 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-oi0-f54.google.com with SMTP id a64so6056786oii.2; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 10:50:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tLe/sCvkT70wg1hoOaFQMumXquwFnGapE092T6Jz0vTA/RHwhywXRsSnJJJhWjp5MPDAK2ximzXNqsYGQ== X-Received: by 10.157.31.117 with SMTP id x50mr4997800otx.160.1466272252484; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 10:50:52 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.202.236.73 with HTTP; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 10:50:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83lh229ywc.fsf@gnu.org> X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:204480 Archived-At: --001a113d148cc0efd40535911cb9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On Sat, Jun 18, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > I see that you consider this a regression. But the change you refer > to was in Emacs 22.1, released 9 years ago, so we've lived with this > long enough to consider your proposal a new feature. Well, we just fixed a 20-year-old documentation bug on markers from some prior discussion, but I see why you might want to view it that way. If the behavior is a bug, no matter how long-standing, it should certainly be given some standing above a regular new feature request. Maybe RMS could comment on whether sort-lines by design should sort only visible lines, e.g. when some are hidden in outlines, or should sort all lines regardless of visibility. I also think > that your proposed change goes farther than just restoring that old > behavior, because outline and its derivatives are not the only modes > that use invisible text. > Can you provide one example where this patch changes the behavior of line sorting in a negative way? That would help to understand your thinking. I have provided the example of where it improves it. This should be simple to resolve by just getting to the bottom of what the function is designed to do in the case of invisible lines. Bob --001a113d148cc0efd40535911cb9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On S= at, Jun 18, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:<= blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px= #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">I see that you consider this a regression.=C2= =A0 But the change you refer
to was in Emacs 22.1, released 9 years ago, so we've lived with this long enough to consider your proposal a new feature.

<= /div>
Well, we just fixed a 20-year-old documentation bug on markers fr= om some prior discussion, but I see why you might want to view it that way.= =C2=A0 If the behavior is a bug, no matter how long-standing, it should cer= tainly be given some standing above a regular new feature request.=C2=A0 Ma= ybe RMS could comment on whether sort-lines by design should sort only visi= ble lines, e.g. when some are hidden in outlines, or should sort all lines = regardless of visibility.