From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lennart Borgman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: face for non-ASCII characters Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2011 20:42:08 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87zknqnsmr.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87bp06nqy4.fsf@lifelogs.com> <877haunq8t.fsf@lifelogs.com> <8739linpib.fsf@lifelogs.com> <86815A0AB7354FA3874096E7B5FA2F08@us.oracle.com> <87tydym9fs.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87lizam8zt.fsf@lifelogs.com> <878vv7imqp.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87k4erh6q3.fsf@lifelogs.com> <874o5uie42.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87y635dll9.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87r58vbj7o.fsf@lifelogs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1303411357 8745 80.91.229.12 (21 Apr 2011 18:42:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2011 18:42:37 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ted Zlatanov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 21 20:42:33 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QCypl-000097-Ez for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 20:42:33 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38436 helo=lists2.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCypk-0008Gp-DR for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:42:32 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:59974) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCypi-0008GY-F2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:42:31 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCyph-0004gP-9Z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:42:30 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ey0-f169.google.com ([209.85.215.169]:42978) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCyph-0004gJ-3m for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:42:29 -0400 Original-Received: by eyd9 with SMTP id 9so5102eyd.0 for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 11:42:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=A9Gdadr2GfljFVX+9x6ny1JW9WO+x31k3R6B8EVgBCg=; b=JE98b/5Gpr+l3KLYiCyZhmovYFi2u955CF9a1ZBVjIS2cn0bu5OaqwuZrhUAMKAGDF 09/78lA4KNxqCv9q9mNz9aHI0tw5YeCzbwH6ZtYliXTjHIxNGxts4Jd3kDuyWVWwWNBz ExDejYueo0EjwLXDXDWqULWp6sx5paZRmg0Gs= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=P6e2RJQYOHptyZLr3RT1pHRXIoL82RMh94eRL7pUa8jtSdz2b1fE4Ykdrd6ufTSEy1 3LO04/vO6fCAFS0VKBll2dgR1K4OYjMSH4fVEUEpx2dZsVBU10eWohAkysL0wFyblfPR yWhHnX1A1e+nfE4nS45LJE4O1kCXxOixorm80= Original-Received: by 10.213.109.199 with SMTP id k7mr766965ebp.134.1303411348086; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 11:42:28 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.213.23.8 with HTTP; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 11:42:08 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87r58vbj7o.fsf@lifelogs.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 209.85.215.169 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:138621 Archived-At: 2011/4/21 Ted Zlatanov : > On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 23:38:12 +0200 Lennart Borgman wrote: > > LB> 2011/4/20 Ted Zlatanov : >>> > LB> I do not know how ELPA handles this. (But I do not think there is any > LB> problems installing all of nXhtml. Everything is autoloaded.) >>> >>> All I want is an easy way to display suspicious characters (as I recall >>> from when we started this discussion over a year ago). =C2=A0I have no >>> problem that you're hosting markchars.el inside nXhtml and I can mirror >>> just that one file into the GNU ELPA, but if nXhtml has to be >>> *installed* in order to use markchars.el, I'll have to write my own >>> version. =C2=A0I think installing a large, unrelated package is an >>> unnecessary burden on those who just want to detect suspicious >>> characters. =C2=A0Can you please confirm one way or the other so I know= what >>> I need to do, mirror or rewrite? >>> >>> Just to be clear, mirroring markchars.el does not require you to change >>> anything. =C2=A0The GNU ELPA machine will pull the latest markchars.el = down >>> daily, that's all. > > LB> nXhtml is not very much more monolitic than ELPA actually. You can us= e > LB> just the basic libraries in nXhtml and get the rest downloaded > LB> automatically when you try to access them. So it contains kind of > LB> "ELPA" inside. > > LB> But that is not the point here, but since you took it up I mention it= . > > LB> As I tried to say nXhtml will somehow be mirrored in ELPA and Reuben > LB> has said that he want to contribute to that process. So please try to > LB> discuss this witrh him. > > If you think about it, this is not a good user experience. > > "You should beware domain names with suspicious characters that are not > in the same script. =C2=A0markchars.el can do it." > > "How do I install it?" > > "You have to install nXhtml, a web development environment." > > "???" Yes, the name and description is misleading. I have been waiting for something like ELPA (with the additonal capabilities in that area that nXhtml provides). > Sorry if this is not what you want to do, but it really doesn't make > sense to force the user to install nXhtml in order to detect suspicious > characters. =C2=A0So I think mirroring or rewriting markchars.el are the = only > options to provide a good user experience. =C2=A0I can't think of any oth= ers. You are maybe misunderstanding part of this. For me the transition is the problem (and maybe the current lack of dynamic loading of libraries from ELPA). I do agree with you where markchars.el should be in the end. It should be in ELPA or Emacs. It is the road we have to think about.