From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Arthur Miller Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A new user perspective about "Changes for emacs 28" Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 15:02:09 +0200 Message-ID: References: <83k0x4mjsv.fsf@gnu.org> <831rjcmgn8.fsf@gnu.org> <897b82c2-8ec2-60c0-f5c3-5ab98f79fbd8@yandex.ru> <20200911114013.vnr6k47bnfqbbvkv@Ergus> <87o8mc4b65.fsf@gmail.com> <20200911150330.jyo65sauphrswf77@Ergus> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="9241"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, nicola.manca85@gmail.com, ams@gnu.org, Dmitry Gutov , Jack Kamm , Eli Zaretskii , drew.adams@oracle.com To: Ergus Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 12 15:02:51 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kH5B4-0002Gb-4C for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; 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envelope-from=arthur.miller@live.com; helo=EUR05-AM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/09/12 09:02:13 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Windows NT kernel [generic] [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, MSGID_FROM_MTA_HEADER=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:255336 Archived-At: Ergus writes: > On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 07:53:38AM -0700, Jack Kamm wrote: >>Ergus writes: >> >>> One thing at the time. Having an alternative to traditional undo that >>> could be enabled with one of the profiles we were discussing before or >>> throw an option in the menubar is (in my opinion) a good first step. >> >>I don't think this needs a profile -- just default keybindings for >>undo-only and undo-redo. In my usage, they don't replace the standard >>undo, rather they complement it. >> > We don't have too many short bindings available for this. > > Also having two "undo" I think is gonna be even more confusing for the > users. With different key-bindings/menu entries and good documentation, it does not need to be confusing. I would emphasize in documentation non-destructive editing history and explain better how Emacs lets one go back and effort between edits; how the editing history branches in a tree-like structure and how it compares to "linear" edit history as (usually) recorded in other applications as a simple stack. Here I would tack on "undo-tree like" interactive graphical visualisation of undo/redo history.