From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: chad Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs on OS X development Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2012 18:07:43 -0700 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1278) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1342141679 6352 80.91.229.3 (13 Jul 2012 01:07:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2012 01:07:59 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Emacs developers To: John Wiegley Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 13 03:07:58 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1SpUMP-0007mU-LC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 13 Jul 2012 03:07:57 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:45744 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SpUMO-00071H-Mf for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 12 Jul 2012 21:07:56 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:32973) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SpUMM-00070z-6O for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 12 Jul 2012 21:07:55 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SpUML-0007mo-04 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 12 Jul 2012 21:07:54 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-qa0-f48.google.com ([209.85.216.48]:53486) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SpUMK-0007mj-Ru for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 12 Jul 2012 21:07:52 -0400 Original-Received: by qadz32 with SMTP id z32so65759qad.0 for ; Thu, 12 Jul 2012 18:07:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=2ZKNZ00kF9OGG2xCkHnA7yAm2zotsCIp9nW5/M/+qW8=; b=ENdAZ1jb8PWUGXuJZuhBXohqYcziZ7C5D9+Qy6zzH6UuaDepyrrkgvG1n3ZQxRD33K JGVXewtiqd3w51lFhXtwT+Hv7zFlWpCfKbges6xhiCk0+V8HSQaQLDYi32A1JnyP1q/5 AhJsEqsMkzGsgff9ZMoLTUzbhiNpJxxU6cDz+T6OhRzATQBe50SQhJH//Mx8eD0IRbMz bkQ31A5qWux9htWUqhard7GrzvE6jSsP+gpX7MuNJ3vXr2DWOYG/arrcBQab3fEdhk9C l02g/hDoZKFr5RoI8lpzVkqODNDhFB6hTn/Asan1K4BVT97x9uhpkg2Cj7IixEf+ULaT thiA== Original-Received: by 10.224.189.17 with SMTP id dc17mr8503712qab.14.1342141672029; Thu, 12 Jul 2012 18:07:52 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [10.0.0.144] ([12.198.236.170]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id u20sm9139790qao.16.2012.07.12.18.07.50 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 12 Jul 2012 18:07:51 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1278) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 209.85.216.48 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:151575 Archived-At: On Jul 12, 2012, at 5:23 PM, John Wiegley wrote: >>>>>> Stefan Monnier writes: >=20 >>> back to nsport. The difference is that noticeable. We have been = hoping the >>> nsport get better. It seems 3 years have passed. >=20 >> Waiting ain't gonna fix it, indeed. >=20 > Stefan, I want to bring up again the possibility of switching the Mac = port > over to Yamamoto's code. Is there any reason not to? I just tried = the ns > port again, and within minutes couldn't tolerate it: >=20 > 1. The colors are washed out, compared to Mac-Port. >=20 > 2. The leading on Courier is all wrong. Example: The pixels from the = top of > capital letters run into the mode-line. I need to set line-spacing = to 3 > just to make text look decent. >=20 > 3. If I switch to *scratch* and turn on flyspell, I can out-type Emacs = very > easily, the lag is that bad. I use the ns port on macosx 10.7.4 every day, compiled from bazaar every few days, and have never seen any of these problems. I've been doing this for years, with the current bzr head and OS release, without trouble. I write a lot more english prose than code these days, maybe=20 that's the difference? > Why are we sticking with the ns port again, when Yamamoto has been so = active > in keeping the Mac-Port patch maintained? There hasn't been a viable mac-port for emacs-24 until very recently (it was announced 31 days ago today). The previous mac port lacked lexbind and bidi, for example. As near as I can tell, something about various people's set-up, hardware, and/or usage patterns makes either the mac port or the ns port really painful (it really does go both ways). Since many of us aren't feeling your pain, and do feel different pain when we try your preferred approach, it shouldn't be too surprising that there's been little motion. It looks like the future-support questions are probably not an issue anymore, so I've been meaning to try out the 24.1-based mac port, but I don't really want to revert from bzr if I can help it. It would be nice if there were an easy way to try to mac port with the current bazaar sources, if if you're looking for some way to spur along the process. Hope that helps, *Chad