From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Yuan Fu Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Propose to add setup-wizard.el to ELPA Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2022 23:58:00 -0800 Message-ID: References: <897ED591-43BC-4029-912A-917E5E9F6930@gmail.com> <87czlarhff.fsf@yahoo.com> <5D13C3C0-C4EB-4769-9685-25122DC9B8DC@gmail.com> <875yr2rfd1.fsf@yahoo.com> <369E183D-87EC-45AB-8352-9A780006561E@gmail.com> <87zgoeps3f.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="13007"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Emacs developers To: Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jan 02 08:59:33 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1n3vm9-0003Dj-8X for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 02 Jan 2022 08:59:33 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:60342 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n3vm8-0002bB-6P for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 02 Jan 2022 02:59:32 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40064) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n3vkj-0001MY-2s for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 02 Jan 2022 02:58:05 -0500 Original-Received: from [2607:f8b0:4864:20::52f] (port=43866 helo=mail-pg1-x52f.google.com) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n3vkh-0002sc-FJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 02 Jan 2022 02:58:04 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-pg1-x52f.google.com with SMTP id 8so27723252pgc.10 for ; Sat, 01 Jan 2022 23:58:02 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=HGYEkpqljLu53+7vj9JhTnLTgMjUxhpmmFt1PGLIeuk=; b=dYselUQ8uOIijSqjCB7KfOXQHHs0FImPkeXGonNj/noCtdNtdiTVz0T4IhFJzkqUuZ jx+UEtxqk5PUuB8bISwfN/Yhql9Ksppek9zxqiQ7KOqM7OKFOSEFhkDnjgFc5CoaZV9g QLVuqSz4G/kepETWCZH9PoMddkTb1Srss4dsmophXDXFY22Ekr6hOvH7c7FsEWicexqU xihnzVe491PYcYEj3zCYI0MyqdXjkZ8goYGxLqGNrsPZNAfbuKDFf88EXbufQrHyGraz 1OpgE2PF/5RtdEzkdFctfSA1Z/n+4SWedoejPJa+KXpsLzKmMIqd+THT6O9fjwJT0T2t zV2A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=HGYEkpqljLu53+7vj9JhTnLTgMjUxhpmmFt1PGLIeuk=; b=jkfgj4SEjVZZ2y3knrH5ox/0lqosFq8wlIRG1nSowmNb4uSqzmmQ0Vow4W+W11km34 3CG7n0KOEYiGJmPFzpLXbI32uNj7DZRDzBnjZVeMFt2eMupxWTb/Gg4e9rWTybHReQOY i1j4gGqdoFqUR0oJ7ixqrpWRSk+Yp4ZBqZlPVxeX7EUALBg5b2wZzavVGAMHPzOikxab eb2ssojhJ8M4U4wXH5HZtoS3FfJt+7wh60MGbFBybkPcL+93prhjrXNlZiSN6B17Pzsu VhUFJk3nC4R1jSxtEar3h96uFFuNmlIJ5ZTIzs+KprPDHwdweBZRTAFXfpMTpUpyGEMb 9goQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533r7z8GGw6bE8UklPk3H9WZ+S5srhUmaAHCLhmpm+Kq4PGJ3Ou9 7TD2ATqCOis+xtO3LytGGGM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxTBepl88uOYs3QKILp8ELAB4RR0ke+tMhDOfDEKMtrsLAkVsQdDvLmeGxHucRoCRHiYFuQZw== X-Received: by 2002:a63:be49:: with SMTP id g9mr13581119pgo.375.1641110281739; Sat, 01 Jan 2022 23:58:01 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from smtpclient.apple ([2600:1700:2ec7:8c90:a095:5ec2:29e1:ba48]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id e16sm32947995pfd.38.2022.01.01.23.58.01 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 01 Jan 2022 23:58:01 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <87zgoeps3f.fsf@yahoo.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2607:f8b0:4864:20::52f (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::52f; envelope-from=casouri@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-x52f.google.com X-Spam_score_int: 6 X-Spam_score: 0.6 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (0.6 / 5.0 requ) DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:283863 Archived-At: > On Jan 1, 2022, at 10:30 PM, Po Lu wrote: >=20 > Yuan Fu writes: >=20 >> I think splitting them into different parts would be confusing. >=20 > What would have to be split into different parts? Keybinding settings and the rest. >=20 >> On the other hand, =E2=80=9Cvariable modified outside Customize=E2=80=9D= isn=E2=80=99t that >> mysterious IMO. >=20 > It is, and it'll be inconsistent as well. >=20 >> Customize=E2=80=99s settings should always override other code, I = think they >> are appended at the end of init.el every time they are saved. >=20 > Not true. >=20 >> Speaking of that, we are not supposed to use custom-save-variables in >> init.el, which makes using custom more undesirable. >=20 > The changes should be made to the custom file if set, and if not, > init.el. >=20 > That's how custom behaves, and that's how this "setup wizard" should > behave as well. Setup wizard produces some code, the user can modify them and put them = in init.el. They can later modify or even delete them as then see fit. = It=E2=80=99s flexible, straightforward, simple. Why do we have to = involve custom and all its machinery? If we use custom, the key binding part is in somewhere in init.el, the = rest are blended together with other random configurations in either = custom file or the custom-save-varaible form in init.el. The custom part = has to be changed through Customize (the comment says users shouldn=E2=80=99= t modify the form by hand, and if they do, custom restores the change = anyway). Yuan