From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Per_Starb=E4ck?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: C-j considered harmful (not really) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 23:37:34 +0100 Message-ID: <912155b0911161437l7d5d5d3h790edff279fdad7a@mail.gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1258411227 23489 80.91.229.12 (16 Nov 2009 22:40:27 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 22:40:27 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Nov 16 23:40:20 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NAAF9-0006VO-WD for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 23:40:20 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49943 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NAAF9-0003dj-Cf for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 17:40:19 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NAACZ-0001wL-F5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 17:37:39 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NAACW-0001uT-2Z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 17:37:39 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=48255 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NAACV-0001uN-OG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 17:37:35 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-bw0-f215.google.com ([209.85.218.215]:43808) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NAACV-0003lG-AS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 17:37:35 -0500 Original-Received: by bwz7 with SMTP id 7so6359361bwz.26 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 14:37:34 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=ZBG1DHxugR9m1qGvdQJV/dk4vDzSXtIjcIU94q9KWH4=; b=PdIfzzURleTA+LCHh7rb5He6uJvuCBlAZTi2gtvdu1EutgxDbgAWIj5VHK8i9iw4/v c338qVQPmzc9PANxQzXGqt/X/D6vuH4G5d5C7gFW05uEj2aq07sSxunt4ORgIvIBXcvt fnS/no9Uvn6qexEFoUiZ+yOHb9kOtGJIh0TGo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject :from:to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=R610s87MsGJOoNMn165l3TEme437ab1HJ6rZhyc0PSRefpH8MX0q0l8wUXJ6nlVP6j X4XGJyoF+YdSjD0bdr2kENwrLYsC6v99jRyxL2DMq2fBVR69zrJP3BeUqlay97dVTt9n VPhxu9V9pCYnHrtYJaUsNnDEqMw8PLSTDxE+c= Original-Received: by 10.223.161.215 with SMTP id s23mr1289599fax.44.1258411054224; Mon, 16 Nov 2009 14:37:34 -0800 (PST) X-Google-Sender-Auth: 7438f3dca2e47e77 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:117052 Archived-At: 2009/11/16 Per Starb=E4ck : > 2009/11/16 David De La Harpe Golden : >> So, ^I for TAB, ^H for backspace, ^[ for escape etc. > > Sure, but I don't like that to be prerequisite knowledge for using Emacs. Which brings me to another point. There is at least one such correspondence that Emacs users are supposed to know about, that I think is unnecessary, and that is C-j =3D LF =3D \n. That is used for example in I-search and in arguments to query-replace etc. I would like some alternative way to enter newline in arguments, something having to do with since that's the key actually associated with "new line" for all those you don't know their ASCII. That key should be used in I-search with the same meaning as C-j has now, and should be possible to use instead of C-q C-j to enter a newline in minibuffer input. Maybe could be used for this? Then this would be an alternative just for people with window systems, but I think people who would benefit from this almost always have a window system anyway.