From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "David De La Harpe Golden" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Using several frames on TTYs, switching them, terminology: [Is also: Tabbed buffers] Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 15:42:26 +0000 Message-ID: <8e24944a0801280742g42d5d579p40c684f601222980@mail.gmail.com> References: <18330.23354.579245.68671@kahikatea.snap.net.nz> <87ejc5sf4l.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <18330.29609.396872.678539@kahikatea.snap.net.nz> <87wspxqwjv.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <20080127195538.GA5014@muc.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1201534981 25917 80.91.229.12 (28 Jan 2008 15:43:01 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 15:43:01 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jan 28 16:43:20 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JJW8b-0003Lj-S0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 16:43:10 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JJW8B-0005tj-3e for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:42:43 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JJW87-0005t6-Dg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:42:39 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JJW81-0005su-VA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:42:38 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JJW81-0005sr-Qr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:42:33 -0500 Original-Received: from el-out-1112.google.com ([209.85.162.181]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JJW81-0002Jd-Uu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:42:34 -0500 Original-Received: by el-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id m34so228096ele.10 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:42:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=aOW0BwiPXEQk6WjXeMYdsNARQ3EMbpIB6HTF53LreXA=; b=nmkYYjgxG7FUpDLXvjKrTUK+0PDWhGRm2XUtnFO5VmOSBOYe9mKtoXL6v8JrmyXu0bb/0JMMbkg2BdS5ELPq5AZf3AVO8nH09CUdnWCpICWGp5aGyO7AT5LtZGTfximZbEbp2iAdkG6/owkOiZ4gpMR2uIcLI0cHPw/YujVAGuE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=TL7d+g6Hfo/QNBAXhqNyPnomHZSb5Z763ffYAQuFgD8sUMZV54kmVEH1oSBUORWm6GBwLT4UpqAa7fCOBqgyeVeraQKtWYBpIjHJpu9pJLjjhTxncD2JPRFSMtBAVdLS2hloUumYMz2VwT+8fGYmmjGEpkwCDz1M1kT5SbbLJtQ= Original-Received: by 10.142.77.11 with SMTP id z11mr2406137wfa.98.1201534946050; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:42:26 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.142.111.4 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:42:26 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: Content-Disposition: inline X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.4-2.6 (Google crawlbot) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:87712 Archived-At: On 28/01/2008, Richard Stallman wrote: > Again, why the word "tab"? > > Because that's the word they are generally called, in regard to > browsers for instance, and what most computer users will know. > Heh. Maybe should rename [emacs] frames to windows and [emacs] windows to panes, too. :-) >> The display stratagem seems redundant - we've already got frames >> and windows - so, would it not be a better idea to have @def{frame >> sets}, a collection of frames displayed in the same place, any one of >> which can be selected by its tab? > > That's not what a tab should do. Tabs should operate within a frame. > [using emacs terminology]: (i) I think by "a collection of frames in the same place" was meant tabs switching between frame contents i.e. sets of windows? They'd be in the one "physical" frame, tabs would select different window configurations i.e. "virtual" frames. That sounds a bit like latter-day-IDE "views" being tabbed. Of course, winner-mode already exists. Maybe emacs just needs to expose general tab bar widgets that winner-mode could then use... (ii) IIRC clicking XEmacs "buffer-tabs" widgets in its "gutters" switches between the buffers in the current window of the current frame though: http://www.xemacs.org/Documentation/21.5/html/xemacs_4.html#SEC16 While the (i) might be useful I think (ii) is probably what people would expect tabs to do if implemented in GNU Emacs (especially since it's what XEmacs already does...). Would rapidly become unwieldy for large buffer counts though. Then again, the menu and toolbar are totally unwieldy for large command counts and probably rapidly get turned off by many advanced emacs users, just as the buffer-tabs would. (You _could_ have both (i) and (ii), really. Would probably look quite cluttered though. Of course maybe the GUI clutter of an IDE with [nonemacs terminology] a zillion tabbed panes holding tabbed panes of tabbed panes (and let's not forget the customary tabbed panes that are too big to fit in the enclosing pane and thus induce horizontal and vertical scrollbars - bleurgh) is what people really /miss/ in emacs :-) )