From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ergus Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: "modern" colors Re: Changes for emacs 28 Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 12:19:53 +0200 Message-ID: <8EE09DC7-28DB-4974-A2F7-12456C6C4A0B@aol.com> References: <87sgbsb0eb.fsf@gmail.com> <20200909165723.kdnwicwvplmezusr@Ergus> <20200910102000.2t6tsju745xutg7u@Ergus> <20200910110832.ko66gqnqo4l664d6@Ergus> <20200911134225.zhnlq7cdhmu2iraj@Ergus> <20200911221435.go7b5kz2zcvxp2ft@Ergus> <83sgbnecka.fsf@gnu.org> <83een7e48t.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="12643"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, casouri@gmail.com, ams@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, ghe@sdf.org, tecosaur@gmail.com To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 12 12:20:48 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kH2eG-0003CA-IB for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 12:20:48 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51064 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kH2eF-0003kA-Kq for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 06:20:47 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38024) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kH2da-0003B8-R2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 06:20:06 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic301-2.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com ([74.6.129.41]:36277) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kH2dX-00070k-Vi for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 06:20:06 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=aol.com; s=a2048; t=1599906002; bh=3WrQwXso5Yz7aqi98TjgZgjIWV5WIk1UBe1IA33MMLE=; h=Date:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:To:From:From:Subject; b=lT5Qqa1CYixe3MVZAD/kJ7WrntXZikkp4KKc6VmmfjbdwTHnMR7oqqgJ6o9JntMYkB7vfBbjHqA3HQFTQpyEndfPbaReAJFpJBHBJiZR+GMdRqvmc1LB/UVY9FdnYs+FWSPY6beGrlCL1ec8NtDddsWWVdWIzBecorw01Dw/ONMSAibjuGZZYd9Znb3qhuz2OXzScr8uhoZpWtYUN4byDP30zZ+wrRLLpH8nymJN1s3ANsV8dqHvUj/5xNGb+7JyBK7HapRkCg3ZGIw8OSYVDxrwuwV7Wsit+22AHrzmIzbUiVe9Xj+sKu9H+tqJlAsw93oPAksZAjWFgY/hFjS2cA== X-YMail-OSG: 8NGbp6gVM1mboFUh.ZItiN8PVPenim79KaT3L_yud3cQgmXiUdA6RNxFpvmWRFX 44dedPN03Gm6WrOkt3QjP.G_FgkIixHWUYqevFGaGUoFuULVvOTlO9xv97fjohPLuPotWzWnjhSU _Lj34Y4sAnijfORBi0ccJgZVD4VJkz1xNh.qJM4L2hnYaubyUsWgu50aDtg_SKf3cyAERjhfNpcU bQ5R_dFgrHD7EJF3QC.KB8E96ESR3Em5u0uRZWyysLzUuCxd6UuLkmReA.z2r_TE6FAjAtVS_gr5 WJepJQ13lZCex690dtm5i_kYX_p4f.bwCyvUC8tYpQyCT9nuSUnfsLFjr2IB6a28.BXCi.VweObd k_jvBwbhAVHFdxLCsLrYlFeMQzjD3KlSweihSnY9OWlloeT2OxjI_ViTWD3aJGfxCRORSpNJwYod pAgAodNv.Dnm90Lcvi1_Oep_HzLblrYIl2uaeIT6AXmmUZUu67ldMJtxDUiPOpQpVEUfhajqq9LG c_45rOPi.bopiL__t9JLKxgcMna4eTPKNTgxNTTgbups0GZ6.u2FFadozsRpmmBRZkVnjartK0W4 eG6bDbiWz3GswrU.Z_3SXYJ8hrxymf.J8Dd_8lQw90KaJmN1Cnsg7T7oS5TwVYv7kaqQYfnKGnrh uGO2YgYIoFlS6EIDjRWvFR_LGEe3t3syYqWv3cXcqpnE.OW0XDnapgciJb8Q1GKWKENnewdr_dzB Rycfa1Wj469g_XSrlRt9TApvqhluXFGtXQiKteDU5P5NhVPBOJk8g_uQYTqzLgyLCHFOr.FPvrQ4 iuSieJgBlawGdLjC3ydOagzQc.VWnFS6HhE47MYpGr Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic301.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 10:20:02 +0000 Original-Received: by smtp408.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID e125ea0d8d5cf4b63c8cb186a210cb5c; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 10:19:59 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <83een7e48t.fsf@gnu.org> X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.16583 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.aol Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/11.0.7) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=74.6.129.41; envelope-from=spacibba@aol.com; helo=sonic301-2.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/09/12 04:29:10 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:255290 Archived-At: On September 12, 2020 11:25:22 AM GMT+02:00, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 11:03:33 +0200 >> CC: >casouri@gmail=2Ecom,ams@gnu=2Eorg,monnier@iro=2Eumontreal=2Eca,ghe@sdf=2E= org,tecosaur@gmail=2Ecom >> From: Ergus >>=20 >> >> 4) Right click: (Probably it is the most lacking functionality and >> >> surprising for any user not using the terminal=2E) Right click is >> >expected >> >> to bring a panel with the most common operations=2E It is useful, >fast >> >> and somehow standard since 1995 while removing most of the needs >of >> >the >> >> toolbar which takes precious vertical space=2E >> > >> >We have this on C-mouse-2 and C-mouse-3=2E Putting those on mouse-2 >and >>=20 >> The menu we have in C-mouse-3 does not show the most basic options >like copy, paste, and so on to >> access them fast=2E > >Why should it? We show the menu for the current major mode, which is >IMO more useful than basic editing=2E > >It's a pity too many newbies don't see the menu bar and the tool bar, >because all this was arranged to have all the important features be >readily available through the different UI elements=2E With the menu >and the tool bar removed, we don't have enough UI elements to satisfy >all the important needs=2E =20 Right click panel is closer and faster to copy paste and so on=2E As well = as expected=2E >Which is one more reason to encourage >newbies to start with the vanilla Emacs, not with the hyper-loaded >"distros"=2E > Not exactly because some of these "distros" already add their own right cl= ick panel=2E (While I agree that most of them end hyper-loaded, but not because of this= specific detail) >> >> 5) sidebar: most code editors have a button somewhere in the >> >interface >> >> to show/hide the sidebar to explore and open files/access symbols >or >> >see >> >> open files=2E >> > >> >We have it in Options->Hide/Show=2E >>=20 >> Yes but the idea behind is to make it very accessible to toggle it on >demand more frequently=2E Maybe we can >> add a bottom for that [>>] in the beginning of the modeline to give a >toggle effect? > >If people agree that Speedbar is so important these days, the mode >line is not a good place for the toggle=2E But I'm not sure people >agree=2E For example, isn't Speedbar important mostly in PL major >modes? what would you do with it in, say, Text mode? So maybe make it >appear automatically in such modes? The sidebars around usually are more like neotree (a file browser) + imenu= -sidebar (program browser if it is a program) + projectile sidebars (a list= of this project's opened files) so there will be at least one of them alwa= ys useful (neotree)=2E If you give a look to the simple geany editor you will see the most basic = implementation of this "ide like" feature=2E =20 --=20 Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E