From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Reitter Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Scratch buffer annoyance Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:28:28 +0100 Message-ID: <8ACF1129-2D04-4157-83F8-0F0F8928A5D2@gmail.com> References: <877ipev1iv.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87lkdhqp94.fsf@red-bean.com> <20070716203244.85A0A30116@Psilocybe.Update.UU.SE> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1184686131 28542 80.91.229.12 (17 Jul 2007 15:28:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 15:28:51 +0000 (UTC) Cc: kfogel@red-bean.com, ams@gnu.org, sdl.web@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 17 17:28:46 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1IAoyi-0002ME-Vf for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:28:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IAoyi-0006RB-7q for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:28:44 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IAoye-0006QJ-3J for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:28:40 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IAoya-0006OK-FC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:28:39 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IAoya-0006O7-9C for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:28:36 -0400 Original-Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com ([66.249.92.173]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1IAoyZ-0002Bp-HU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:28:35 -0400 Original-Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 34so175622ugf for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 08:28:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type:message-id:cc:content-transfer-encoding:from:subject:date:to:x-mailer; b=de5jSPOpXGio+Pm8VPnmL6K7UXdceKQZWXmBpD5xYCbmwG0OZCXVzSZtfUhkmaCjgbh8AkOD8k1TF2aMvdo6tS6WKsKcl23NYMw9BnGQg2qZa4qouSRmmKYvy04Yc44ms/+dIy7Ay4lkccM0HMzRHpwyq1KIyz/5uEENRz5WuUY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type:message-id:cc:content-transfer-encoding:from:subject:date:to:x-mailer; b=J7KhsZUEx4JcVbck1UFOi/gY77ScVeAyMyAlS1hdsjslLL2+7MDo+HTNtibpQmixoQz+nhhVponIMDuHkk9K/WlK7tGIdCrXHIm75CDgaG3NYzg/AQkUOhif8WY6nQr7Pid6yP5+thfJ28E5Vl4M5QBBTuI2RFgVP1raatIvmUY= Original-Received: by 10.66.232.9 with SMTP id e9mr401600ugh.1184686112990; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 08:28:32 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from ?129.215.174.81? ( [129.215.174.81]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id u6sm4475649uge.2007.07.17.08.28.30 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 17 Jul 2007 08:28:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-detected-kernel: Linux 2.4-2.6 (Google crawlbot) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:74991 Archived-At: On 17 Jul 2007, at 16:05, Richard Stallman wrote: > Wouldn't it be smarter to make the initial splash screen the > current > buffer when Emacs starts instead? It would make sense for that > to be > read-only, and when one does C-x C-q, it could for example > clear it > and toggle the read-only status of the buffer (with a brief > note in > the initial splash screen that one can do C-x C-q to convert it > into a > "scratch" buffer). > > It is an interesting idea. What do others think? This will make Emacs even more difficult to use for new or occasional users. They would need to know a key combination just to get started. And it would be much more annoying than the current situation. What's wrong with - automatically saving *scratch* in a place other than ~/ (where it is out of the way) via auto-save and before exiting Emacs, without any user interaction - automatically restoring *scratch* from that file upon startup (i.e. making it persistent) - not offering to save it anywhere else (even though users may to C-x C-w and save it, thereby converting it to a normal, non-persistent buffer, and creating an empty *scratch* buffer automatically). This would preserve the equivalence to a real-life scratch paper that one keeps on one's desk, which will not magically disappear overnight, but which may be filed somewhere else when needed. It would be unobtrusive and solve the original problem. Oh, and it should be in text-mode, because most users will not want to hack Elisp.