From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ihor Radchenko Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] New package: jami-bot and org-jami-bot Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2024 12:38:07 +0000 Message-ID: <87y1cupw0g.fsf@localhost> References: <875y0i7e43.fsf@hoowl.se> <87y1cyqoso.fsf@posteo.net> <83r0inj9oi.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4094"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Stefan Kangas , rms@gnu.org, philipk@posteo.net, hanno@hoowl.se, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Jan 12 13:35:48 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rOGlI-0000oW-33 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 13:35:48 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rOGka-00049h-VP; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 07:35:05 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rOGkY-00049T-TA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 07:35:02 -0500 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rOGkU-0003va-TJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 07:35:02 -0500 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7BCE2240029 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 13:34:56 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1705062896; bh=5dinW9b2B/01DOEC+CFA7HKeh7ddLMB8Ta3qwUqlXSo=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:From; b=LbMqkDyBrefrtBpmYeDh9Q9Qo4EbVgce3vgKzt8HRstll8ejZBli1tXZTtEYjWWT5 slna8X7QxvjUCZ260d7DOncLEMuOJHimeu/00PGM4u1Mh/wniLILS7K3UUXF48anvu 3LTsLnyUNSECrHFhsN0LN4NcGjl0zJlqOpcaR3748kQ3en6Fj5577bhGiucn3vusgq KEUVkJOvQAlkofzwq2CUI19gEi9hygR2q77+JDBqHyAf1kq2O0Hv8TMs5CiMuTPG4I sR3GL2UlFVWrrPF5L67GEqGBNNhmB5onoZqZTmW4Mg8EASSmTCQBNsjbi45k88piuA WDEBMScHfw/Sw== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4TBLb32pDYz6tyy; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 13:34:55 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <83r0inj9oi.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:314900 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> ... The Org maintainers themselves proposed >> some features (org-protocol and org-capture) that are good candidates to >> separate from Org in this very thread. > > What about ox-* packages? Could they be converted to more > generally-useful export capabilities for Emacs? Kind of. ox-* packages mostly rely on ox.el capabilities + Org mode parsed representation. ox.el is also relying on the parsed representation, except a few places. If someone writes a parser that can understand alternative, non-Org markup of source files, and produce org-element-ast.el-compatible list structure, most of the ox-* exporters should remain functional. > In general, I feel that the various useful capabilities in Org were > generalized only to the level of Org, but not beyond that. Look at > ob-* or oc-* or ol-* -- these could be the basis of Emacs features > useful in other places, but they are written in Org-specific ways that > make using them elsewhere difficult and sometimes even nonsensical. > > I think patches to bring at least some of that into Emacs will be very > welcome, in the same way we nowadays use some originally Gnus-only > features in Emacs outside of Gnus (the most prominent example is > message.el, but there are others). oc-* is a part of the ox-* family. ob-* for code evaluation libraries are not very modular currently - they use a lot of ad-hoc regexp matching that is very difficult to generalize. Much more difficult compared to exporter libraries (although, not impossible). If someone is up to extracting things from Org mode, and choosing between babel and export parts, I recommend trying export first. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at