bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Robert Pluim]

It makes the display of eg `electric-quote-chars' much more readable

Robert
-- 

diff --git a/lisp/help-fns.el b/lisp/help-fns.el
index 182b22549b5..2d85dac22de 100644
--- a/lisp/help-fns.el
+++ b/lisp/help-fns.el
@@ -1349,7 +1349,8 @@ describe-variable
 		      (print-rep
 		       (let ((rep
 			      (let ((print-quoted t)
-                                    (print-circle t))
+                                    (print-circle t)
+                                    (print-integers-as-characters t))
                                 (cl-prin1-to-string val))))
                          (if (and (symbolp val) (not (booleanp val)))
 			     (format-message "`%s'" rep)

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Mattias Engdegård]

15 maj 2024 kl. 11.33 skrev Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>:

> It makes the display of eg `electric-quote-chars' much more readable

And `fill-column` much less readable. On balance, the loss of readability for numbers that are not characters seems to outweigh the gain for those that are.

We could have stateful buttons controlling the display, which could also include things like printing numbers in hex and control chars in strings as escape sequences.

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 11:33:58 +0200
> 
> It makes the display of eg `electric-quote-chars' much more readable

Yes, but what does it do to display of blink-cursor-blinks (and any
other variable whose value is a small integer)?

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 12:13:49 +0200
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> 
> We could have stateful buttons controlling the display, which could also include things like printing numbers in hex and control chars in strings as escape sequences.

Or maybe the doc string could provide meta-data about how to display
such values?

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Robert Pluim]

>>>>> On Wed, 15 May 2024 12:13:49 +0200, Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com> said:

    Mattias> 15 maj 2024 kl. 11.33 skrev Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>:
    >> It makes the display of eg `electric-quote-chars' much more readable

    Mattias> And `fill-column` much less readable. On balance, the
    Mattias> loss of readability for numbers that are not characters
    Mattias> seems to outweigh the gain for those that are.

We could add a limit to print-integers-as-characters above which it
takes effect (default '0').

Or we could look at the custom-type of the variable to see if it is or
contains 'character'.

    Mattias> We could have stateful buttons controlling the display,
    Mattias> which could also include things like printing numbers in
    Mattias> hex and control chars in strings as escape sequences.

Iʼm not entirely sure youʼre being serious here :-) , but that seems
like overkill.

Robert
-- 

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Philip Kaludercic]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>
>> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 12:13:49 +0200
>> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> 
>> We could have stateful buttons controlling the display, which could
>> also include things like printing numbers in hex and control chars
>> in strings as escape sequences.
>
> Or maybe the doc string could provide meta-data about how to display
> such values?

Why not bind it depending on the type of the user option?

electric-quote-chars is (list character character character character),
fill-column is integer, for example.

-- 
	Philip Kaludercic on peregrine

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>
> Cc: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>,
>   rpluim@gmail.com,
>   emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 05:46:21 +0000
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> 
> >> From: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>
> >> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 12:13:49 +0200
> >> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> >> 
> >> We could have stateful buttons controlling the display, which could
> >> also include things like printing numbers in hex and control chars
> >> in strings as escape sequences.
> >
> > Or maybe the doc string could provide meta-data about how to display
> > such values?
> 
> Why not bind it depending on the type of the user option?

How do you tell "the type of the user option"?

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Philip Kaludercic]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>
>> Cc: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>,
>>   rpluim@gmail.com,
>>   emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 05:46:21 +0000
>> 
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
>> 
>> >> From: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>
>> >> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 12:13:49 +0200
>> >> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> >> 
>> >> We could have stateful buttons controlling the display, which could
>> >> also include things like printing numbers in hex and control chars
>> >> in strings as escape sequences.
>> >
>> > Or maybe the doc string could provide meta-data about how to display
>> > such values?
>> 
>> Why not bind it depending on the type of the user option?
>
> How do you tell "the type of the user option"?

E.g. using (get 'fill-column 'custom-type) ;=> integer

As a heuristic, one could check if a type consists just of characters
(e.g. a character, a list of characters, etc.) and only then bind
`print-integers-as-characters'.

-- 
	Philip Kaludercic on peregrine

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Robert Pluim]

>>>>> On Thu, 16 May 2024 11:45:37 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> said:

    >> From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>
    >> Cc: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>,
    >> rpluim@gmail.com,
    >> emacs-devel@gnu.org
    >> Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 05:46:21 +0000
    >> 
    >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
    >> 
    >> >> From: Mattias Engdegård <mattias.engdegard@gmail.com>
    >> >> Date: Wed, 15 May 2024 12:13:49 +0200
    >> >> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
    >> >> 
    >> >> We could have stateful buttons controlling the display, which could
    >> >> also include things like printing numbers in hex and control chars
    >> >> in strings as escape sequences.
    >> >
    >> > Or maybe the doc string could provide meta-data about how to display
    >> > such values?
    >> 
    >> Why not bind it depending on the type of the user option?

    Eli> How do you tell "the type of the user option"?

(get 'electric-quote-chars 'custom-type)
=> (list character character character character)

Robert
-- 

Re: bind print-integers-as-characters to t in `describe-variable'?

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>
> Cc: mattias.engdegard@gmail.com,  rpluim@gmail.com,  emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 09:05:34 +0000
> 
> >> Why not bind it depending on the type of the user option?
> >
> > How do you tell "the type of the user option"?
> 
> E.g. using (get 'fill-column 'custom-type) ;=> integer

You took the easy case.  In a more general case, we'd need a parser to
understand what's TRT:

  (get 'electric-quote-chars 'custom-type)
    => (list character character character character)

And we definitely could have defcustoms which say 'integer', but can
accept both numbers and characters.

And then there are variables, not user options ("C-h v" is not only
for defcustom's).