From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: MELPA version numbers Date: Thu, 01 Aug 2013 23:57:00 +0300 Message-ID: <87wqo5ku3n.fsf@yandex.ru> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1375393275 1694 80.91.229.3 (1 Aug 2013 21:41:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2013 21:41:15 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Steve Purcell , Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Donald Ephraim Curtis Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 01 23:41:17 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1V50cW-0006sf-G0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 23:41:16 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38831 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1V50cW-0007MT-4n for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:41:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42809) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1V50cP-0007LK-OI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:41:14 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1V50A1-0008Ly-OV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:11:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wi0-x229.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c05::229]:49023) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1V4zvq-0002tM-Qw for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 16:57:10 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wi0-f169.google.com with SMTP id f14so85079wiw.0 for ; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 13:57:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:cc:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=DTijVHnWY3LxwrAGMuXz7xPd1GuHmN04ErgXsFrj4xs=; b=u8BelqAD97Dzr1/8ixtiY7wfz2ujPJnzJ6e536ApLZ45FYpB7Yzfdemxie4ezCgInn 6XwvAqzbLwtNkfZ0H1LKE+eXBjw5SfFBYNXWraHMCl11VwYE+c7k1E+yoBJD6fuPLMH2 vIW4gLofbYaeQhUihnaiKyXLIFjDM7Z+VeSUJjsYFPfhW0M7CmQy4d2HJxiDpAfi56at zNPPs0LJd2qf5CK1aS9qTuWyc4GQoHxSq6ImuI7WIbKQYKjxdM0XF7ujMmW6K2k0ScIk Y3/L8ZsAFgqLGR0hP77AZGkg7UD07sUm40ScM/Q7xpkl65gva58olfH3HiwiIaIJXpZ8 BYJw== X-Received: by 10.180.10.138 with SMTP id i10mr9138514wib.53.1375390629857; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 13:57:09 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from axl (62-59-241.netrun.cytanet.com.cy. [62.228.59.241]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id o10sm259057wiz.5.2013.08.01.13.57.07 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 01 Aug 2013 13:57:08 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Thu, 01 Aug 2013 13:50:48 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c05::229 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:162342 Archived-At: Resending. Stefan Monnier writes: > [ As is sadly becoming the norm nowadays, it's difficult to find > a contact email address at http://melpa.milkbox.net/, so I send this > here instead, hoping someone here will know where to resend it for > me. ] AFAICT, the discussions mostly happen on GitHub issues. That way, they're visible to the largest amount of users. > A few times now I've heard people suffer from problems due to MELPA's > use of incomparable version numbers: MELPA builds packages straight from > a DVCS branch tip, so you get the "bleeding edge" and their build script > ignores the package's own version number and instead just slaps > a version number based on the current time, such as 20100105.123. > > This system makes sense, but if the package is also available (in it's > "latest released version") via GNU ELPA or Marmalade, we have a problem > because the two version numbers can't be compared correctly, and > package.el doesn't even know it, so it just always picks MELPA's version > (since 20100105.123 is "clearly" much more recent than say 2.3). > > This mess works surprisingly well in practice, since MELPA's versions > are often at least as recent as the one on GNU ELPA or Maramalde (by virtue > of being the bleeding edge from the DVCS). > > But if you ever stop using MELPA, all your MELPA-installed packages will > stay non-updated for the foreseeable future since it'll take a while for > foo.el to go from version 2.3 to version 20100106.0. > And if for some reason the MELPA recipe points to an old DVCS > unmaintained branch, you're similarly out of luck. > > One way out of this is to change the MELPA version numbers so that > instead of ignoring the package's "2.3" and replacing it with > "20100105.123", it should replace it with "2.3.20100105.123". I like this approach in abstract, but if Melpa just switches to it, all existing users will have to know somehow to reinstall all installed packages manually. Otherwise, they won't ever update, for the same reason as why you're bringing up this issue. > WDYT?