From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: On being web-friendly and why info must die Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2014 09:38:04 +0100 Organization: Organization?!? Message-ID: <87vblnn9cj.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> References: <20141205123549.GA29331@thyrsus.com> <87mw72lyzs.fsf@earlgrey.lan> <20141205190925.GA5067@thyrsus.com> <20141206061019.GC14890@thyrsus.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1417941538 27255 80.91.229.3 (7 Dec 2014 08:38:58 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 08:38:58 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Dec 07 09:38:48 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XxXMc-0002SQ-Qz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 09:38:46 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57344 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XxXMc-0000sC-9f for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 03:38:46 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:38563) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XxXMJ-0000rK-IY for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 03:38:33 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XxXMC-0000UF-A3 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 03:38:27 -0500 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:37818) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XxXMC-0000Tb-2f for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 03:38:20 -0500 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XxXMA-0002EB-NF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 09:38:18 +0100 Original-Received: from x2f4fd17.dyn.telefonica.de ([2.244.253.23]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 09:38:18 +0100 Original-Received: from dak by x2f4fd17.dyn.telefonica.de with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 09:38:18 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 31 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: x2f4fd17.dyn.telefonica.de X-Face: 2FEFf>]>q>2iw=B6, xrUubRI>pR&Ml9=ao@P@i)L:\urd*t9M~y1^:+Y]'C0~{mAl`oQuAl \!3KEIp?*w`|bL5qr,H)LFO6Q=qx~iH4DN; i"; /yuIsqbLLCh/!U#X[S~(5eZ41to5f%E@'ELIi$t^ Vc\LWP@J5p^rst0+('>Er0=^1{]M9!p?&:\z]|;&=NP3AhB!B_bi^]Pfkw User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:JD5DvPN9oEUdMwtsiq81fao4E+U= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:179238 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >>> Until there is a documentation viewer available in Elisp that is almost >>> as good as Info-mode while being prettier, >> Does a web browser not qualify? > > Notice the "in Elisp" and "prettier". So far I don't know of any such > thing, web browser or not. "prettier" for an Info mode replacement it to be taken with a huuuge grain of salt. Emacs is an editor, its fonts, foreground, background are (hopefully) configured for maximum readability. When jumping back and forth between work area and documentation, "pretty" takes a hefty backseat towards readability. The normal web page appearance, in contrast, has somewhat different main targets. So it may well be that a generic browser alone, written in Elisp or not, does not yet meet the usability offered by Info mode. Basically what would be nice is an Info browser that just pulls the same information from HTML that it pulls from Info files these days but does not significantly differ except in file format. And preferably not taking noticeably longer for parsing and display. And supporting things like full-document search for which it needs to have an idea about how to get the full document. And, of course, not needing the source on disk. If one can just transparently run an Info-like browser on the online documentation of software, this is a nice boon even though it comes with the problem of version mismatch between installed software and online documentation. -- David Kastrup