From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Karl Fogel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: sqlite3 Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2021 16:17:01 -0600 Message-ID: <87v8zqkf1e.fsf@red-bean.com> References: <874k7ljwkr.fsf@gnus.org> <87fsr5cuzq.fsf@ericabrahamsen.net> <878rwx8mdn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgpdhw4d.fsf@yahoo.com> <2F63580E-FF58-45D0-9DBB-389ED64C0F11@mit.edu> <83v8zzw867.fsf@gnu.org> <87wnk7kkxp.fsf@red-bean.com> Reply-To: Karl Fogel Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="34524"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.90 (gnu/linux) Cc: Qiantan Hong , rms@gnu.org, eric@ericabrahamsen.net, cesar.mena@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, luangruo@yahoo.com, Eli Zaretskii To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Dec 14 23:18:25 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mxG7t-0008pe-5y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 14 Dec 2021 23:18:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55726 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mxG7r-00028Y-C7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 14 Dec 2021 17:18:23 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:35008) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mxG6o-0001PX-1e for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 14 Dec 2021 17:17:18 -0500 Original-Received: from sanpietro.red-bean.com ([45.79.25.59]:42698) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mxG6l-00010I-6t; Tue, 14 Dec 2021 17:17:17 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=red-bean.com; s=202005newsp; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID: In-Reply-To:Date:Reply-To:References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=8DStXO6tV0eGito6VLZ7E4pTDuywdUufaECifRT9W3U=; t=1639520234; x=1640729834; b=hx+lIjoUzHKbadlnEpDj6Ey4yDXCi13FoRCvOnZMRukWjRBH6rPzpgTKYSqcTH/Rh6dH/BCoSS0 N8EZ234yMA4TC9HCnIGSmSdC0VdDiMMgaUgYm3iaka8qUV3oKhbj+5f3VMu1Xky/GqA1NKODOc4uO 4BxW04G5aRls7KPw1YFISreD+ckY0J6XNCgFC6zlsbcnNftOyhnDVCuOJHTktDF2/PzrjRlACk0Ot j7Ez84CI1cb5e+20EMTbaGC/99mDHjKFcShrDsapCUxW2Qeml3BU7h/CSQkic1Xjz4wSrff0ppSAm /ywghKtrcMxuKDrqWxA8lG4yBLrkIF7oZj/Q==; Original-Received: from 99-112-125-163.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net ([99.112.125.163]:43978 helo=floss) by sanpietro.red-bean.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1mxG6Z-00H9Ft-5e; Tue, 14 Dec 2021 22:17:03 +0000 In-Reply-To: (Alan Mackenzie's message of "Tue, 14 Dec 2021 22:01:33 +0000") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=45.79.25.59; envelope-from=kfogel@red-bean.com; helo=sanpietro.red-bean.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:281950 Archived-At: On 14 Dec 2021, Alan Mackenzie wrote: >Yes, those are the plusses. The downsides are the bloat (i don't >know by >how much), the dilution in Emacs's purpose (it's even less the >"do one >thing and do it well" than it was), and I suppose there might >even be >negative security implications (it's a database after all). Also >people >will be forced to learn new tools, both inside and outside of >Emacs. I >fear it will create another elite in the Emacs project, those who >have >mastered sqlite, similar to, for example, those who can read and >write >the cl- library. If it's any comfort, sqlite3 is small, both in source code and memory footprint. (Famously small -- part of its purpose [1] is to be small enough that it can be bundled even into constrained environments.) And it's *very* easy to use if one has any SQL-ish database experience at all. At a time when I had zero sqlite experience, I switched a MySQL-based application to sqlite3 in a couple of hours or so; at no point was it difficult. Anyone who basically groks SQL databases will grok sqlite very quickly. It's tiny and simple. It's nowhere near the CL library in terms of complexity, and I think there is no danger of creating a new elite here. Best regards, -Karl [1] https://sqlite.org/footprint.html