From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Adding a generic mathematical library Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2024 15:13:13 +0200 Message-ID: <87v80y3n2u.fsf@dataswamp.org> References: <87wmllqq66.fsf@posteo.net> <87plrdqnhc.fsf@posteo.net> <87le21qldj.fsf_-_@posteo.net> <878qy1at52.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87ikwz5nll.fsf@dataswamp.org> <875xsz5g07.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87v80z3wkq.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87ed7n3sav.fsf@dataswamp.org> <878qxv3pz4.fsf@dataswamp.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="33862"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:o/T5Phrdy5n3hny8StJUv2sWlHM= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jul 21 16:18:49 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1sVXOi-0008cd-RZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 16:18:48 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sVXO3-0000YY-PG; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 10:18:07 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sVWNX-00072L-1i for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 09:13:31 -0400 Original-Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sVWNV-0006ir-71 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 09:13:30 -0400 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1sVWNS-0003pv-L8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 15:13:26 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Mail-Copies-To: never Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 21 Jul 2024 10:18:05 -0400 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:321879 Archived-At: Christopher Dimech wrote: > Richard has suggested extracting a calc function that > includes a substantial amount of code to do a specific kind > of calculation. > > To address Eli's valid criticism and focus on something > practical and existing, let's enhance the existing emacs > calc package for mathematical computations. Ah, right, that is true, the way both reacted to this whole thing and now this timely decision, there is absolutely nothing fishy going on, they do it out of concern for calc - I see. Calc is as you say a package and a tool. Why it should monopolize and assimilate generic math libraries I wonder? Instead, it should focus on its interface and some settings perhaps at the most and when in need of math, consult a library for that - a generic library that anyone and everyone could use just as well. That said, calc has a lot of good stuff, just using that code isn't natural in any way for whatever computation you would like to do in Elisp or in your own application? Yeah, it is completely backwards actually! Instead of a tool using a library, we here attach the library as an underbelly to the tool! Maybe some guy in the 80s came up with that design but, as the saying goes, development has gone forward. Truth to the matter, people are not gonna be enthusiastic about that, everyone knows that, and that tool isn't used a lot as it is and this is likely to decrease even more. If we had real libraries, people could do new tools, including tools we cannot imagine right now. And some people could work on the libraries, other people could work on the tools. But it is what it is. Couple of too many mistakes and then it is not going to happen. -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal