From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel,gmane.emacs.pretest.bugs Subject: Re: 23.0.60; Feature request: Menu item "load init files" after -q/-Q Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2008 03:46:17 +0900 Message-ID: <87tzig16o6.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1207420640 31565 80.91.229.12 (5 Apr 2008 18:37:20 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2008 18:37:20 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org, Reiner Steib To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 05 20:37:52 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JiDGt-0002rI-4u for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 20:37:47 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JiDGG-0004Jp-6T for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:08 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JiDGC-0004Iw-KX for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:04 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JiDGA-0004GV-Sl for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:04 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JiDGA-0004GC-MZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:02 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JiDGA-0003CP-El for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:02 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.gnu.org ([199.232.76.166] helo=mx10.gnu.org) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1JiDGA-0006fC-3w for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JiDG6-0003Br-L7 for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:37:02 -0400 Original-Received: from mtps01.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp ([130.158.97.223]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JiDFz-00039D-7S; Sat, 05 Apr 2008 14:36:51 -0400 Original-Received: from uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp [130.158.99.156]) by mtps01.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80BBC1535AC; Sun, 6 Apr 2008 03:36:48 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: by uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 0C2621A29F3; Sun, 6 Apr 2008 03:46:18 +0900 (JST) In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: VM 7.19 under 21.5 (beta28) "fuki" 2785829fe37c XEmacs Lucid X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:94428 gmane.emacs.pretest.bugs:21880 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: > > when XEmacs is started with `--vanilla' or `-q', it displays an item > > "Load init files" in the menu bar. The name of the command in XEmacs > > is `load-user-init-file'. > > > > Maybe Emacs should do have something similar. The common use case for this feature is a user reports a bug, we ask them to replicate with "xemacs -vanilla", and now they have error messages and stuff in buffers. So they hit the "Send Mail" menu item and get the horrible default MUA when they were expecting Gnus or VM. An "in-your-face" button makes it easy to get these users to a semblance of sanity, where they can comfortably compose mail, copy buffers, make attachments, etc, in the comfort of their home customizations. > If a non-trivial .emacs is loaded after Emacs starts, the effect might > be different from the same .emacs loaded at startup, due to the stage > of the startup sequence where .emacs is normally loaded. This could > surprise users, You're right about the logic, but I've never heard of such a problem in 10 years of reading XEmacs lists daily. > unless we write a special load function that takes care of these > subtleties. In XEmacs, basically the only things that happen after loading the init files are (1) defvar'ing the user's mail address to a computed default, (2) putting text into the scratch buffer, and (3) running after-init-hook (these are not necessarily in order, but they're almost certainly independent). (Note that "load-user-init-file" is a misnomer in that default.el gets loaded too, unless the user suppresses it.) If the init files tromp on the mail address when loaded out of order, that's almost surely a good thing. Text in the scratch buffer is not of interest here. So to protect the user, all you really need to do is warn them if after-init-hook is non-nil. YMMV; Mike Sperber has done a full-body-replacement on our startup.el, so I suspect the resemblence to any Emacs version is now nil.