From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ted Zlatanov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Silk icon set for Gnus and synchronizing it into Emacs Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2011 15:27:26 -0500 Organization: =?utf-8?B?0KLQtdC+0LTQvtGAINCX0LvQsNGC0LDQvdC+0LI=?= @ Cienfuegos Message-ID: <87tyes4635.fsf@lifelogs.com> References: <87sjugi4rc.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87aaglsvjk.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87lj05ohcf.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87fwqdk7j7.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87ipv8pcc8.fsf@stupidchicken.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1300998476 10878 80.91.229.12 (24 Mar 2011 20:27:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2011 20:27:56 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Mar 24 21:27:52 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q2r8J-0003WY-2Y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 21:27:51 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48355 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Q2r8I-00009w-CV for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 16:27:50 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=48252 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Q2r8D-00007U-It for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 16:27:46 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q2r8C-0002v5-8V for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 16:27:45 -0400 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:36045) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q2r8B-0002uR-Up for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 16:27:44 -0400 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q2r88-0003Pw-82 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 21:27:40 +0100 Original-Received: from 38.98.147.130 ([38.98.147.130]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 21:27:40 +0100 Original-Received: from tzz by 38.98.147.130 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 24 Mar 2011 21:27:40 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 59 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 38.98.147.130 X-Face: bd.DQ~'29fIs`T_%O%C\g%6jW)yi[zuz6; d4V0`@y-~$#3P_Ng{@m+e4o<4P'#(_GJQ%TT= D}[Ep*b!\e,fBZ'j_+#"Ps?s2!4H2-Y"sx" User-Agent: Gnus/5.110016 (No Gnus v0.16) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:QHwcrmugxoDPcohfxe6F7wQnRso= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-Received-From: 80.91.229.12 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:137654 Archived-At: On Thu, 24 Mar 2011 15:06:47 -0400 Chong Yidong wrote: CY> So, the images that we distribute with Emacs are "the images that Emacs CY> needs". If Gnus or any other package in Emacs needs extra *specific* CY> icons, by the way, we should not hesitate to add them to etc/images. OK. CY> If I understand you correctly, you want something different: for Emacs CY> to provide a complete set of images that arbitrary Emacs applications CY> might need. While I agree that Emacs programmers might be happy with CY> the easy availability of such icons, adding hundreds of files to the CY> Emacs tarfile, not directly used by Emacs, strikes me as wasteful. As I said, it can be a single image or in some other compact format (e.g. http://www.famfamfam.com/lab/icons/silk/famfamfam_silk_icons_v013.zip could be used directly). So I don't think it's wasteful--if anything, it saves a lot of work maintaining individual images. CY> People make jokes about the Emacs operating system, I think even more people use and rely on Emacs every day, and that's more important :) My proposal aims to improve the Emacs platform so applications running on it can provide a better user experience. CY> but in truth we've placed a lot of emphasis on using existing CY> operating system resources. Icon sets are an operating system CY> resource. I disagree. Some are provided by the platform but not in a reliable cross-platform way, and certainly not as conveniently named as Silk's icons. CY> That's why I was talking about extending x-gtk-stock-map to other CY> platforms---the idea is to provide a cross-platform solution for CY> Emacs applications to access the operating system's icons. I think that's useful but insufficient. So I propose iconset.el to manage the general "give me an icon from iconset X or from a Gnome theme or from the OS" task. Then iconset-silk.el for the specific Silk icons; iconset-gnome.el to manage the Gnome themes and icons, and iconset-gtk.el to access x-gtk-stock-map. At the top level the API user should be able to specify either a semantic meaning ("the best available icon for the text/plain MIME type") or a specific icon ("the Silk css_valid icon"), together with a priority list to specify "best." CY> Although adding Silk as an ELPA package is tempting, but I'm not CY> certain. Suppose a package wants one single icon from Silk. If it CY> depends on the Silk package, installing it means also downloading and CY> installing the hundreds of Silk icons, which is, again, wasteful. Or is CY> the idea to make Silk an optional dependency, so that the package will CY> display icons only if Silk is installed? Yes, I think it will be optional through iconset.el. When the user installs iconset-silk.el, iconset.el will automatically provide it. So I propose iconset.el (plus the Gnome theme/GTK glue) goes into the Emacs core, while iconset-silk.el lives in the GNU ELPA. Ted