From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ted Zlatanov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Is it time to drop ChangeLogs? Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2016 13:03:07 -0400 Organization: =?utf-8?B?0KLQtdC+0LTQvtGAINCX0LvQsNGC0LDQvdC+0LI=?= @ Cienfuegos Message-ID: <87shvmem2c.fsf@lifelogs.com> References: <56BE7E37.3090708@cs.ucla.edu> <4hd1rw1ubr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83vb50wxhv.fsf@gnu.org> <87y49vz4cg.fsf@acer.localhost.com> <87twg2g86g.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83eg76n5h5.fsf@gnu.org> <87y45eeoor.fsf@lifelogs.com> <8337nmn2pd.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1467824625 2521 80.91.229.3 (6 Jul 2016 17:03:45 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2016 17:03:45 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 06 19:03:36 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bKqEZ-0005rB-1h for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 19:03:35 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:34931 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKqEY-0005PU-Ct for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 13:03:34 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:39572) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKqEO-0005PJ-7J for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 13:03:28 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKqEL-0002OH-14 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 13:03:24 -0400 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:54476) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKqEK-0002Nu-Qz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 13:03:20 -0400 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bKqED-0005b2-Cw for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 19:03:13 +0200 Original-Received: from c-98-229-60-157.hsd1.ma.comcast.net ([98.229.60.157]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 19:03:13 +0200 Original-Received: from tzz by c-98-229-60-157.hsd1.ma.comcast.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 19:03:13 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-Lines: 48 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-98-229-60-157.hsd1.ma.comcast.net X-Face: bd.DQ~'29fIs`T_%O%C\g%6jW)yi[zuz6; d4V0`@y-~$#3P_Ng{@m+e4o<4P'#(_GJQ%TT= D}[Ep*b!\e,fBZ'j_+#"Ps?s2!4H2-Y"sx" Mail-Copies-To: never User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:rypmLeW6TNM/zWzKQL8bKJY9GRU= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:205271 Archived-At: On Wed, 06 Jul 2016 19:36:30 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Ted Zlatanov >> Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2016 12:06:28 -0400 >> >> ChangeLog-style formatting. Sorry. I was talking about the benefits and >> reasons for having that specific format and the problems from when the >> format is not followed (bad formatting, misspellings, etc.) EZ> What format do you suggest instead? "Summary line. Details..." Where the Details can be in the current or another format or whatever works for the contributor. The per-file summary would be available from the pull request system, regardless of the formatting of the commit message. EZ> The advantage of the current formatting is that we have Emacs features EZ> which support it very well. Any other formatting will have to grow a EZ> similar support first. And then we all need to re-learn. Good points. I'm trying to say all the support code can move to the pull request system, so it won't go away, and the transition can be gradual. EZ> IOW, isn't this suggestion going to favor casual contributors over EZ> those who push commits day in and day out? Yes, exceptions should be made for those regular contributors. But you know that some features merit discussion, even if a very senior contributor wants them. >> I was trying to say that using a pull request system would reduce the >> need for writing every commit message as if it was going into a >> ChangeLog, and would give better assurance that mistakes are caught >> before they get merged. It has many other benefits (code review, >> community feedback) but I was commenting specifically for ChangeLogs, >> following up to an old message. EZ> As I wrote, I have doubts that we will be able to sustain such a EZ> system. Maybe I'm wrong. If I understand correctly, your concern is about logistics rather than about the fundamental benefits of such a system. I share your concerns and think the risk is worth the benefit. Ted