unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Uwe Brauer]

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Hi

I am sending this email to four mailing list I am using most, and I am
wondering whether this subject has came up in the past.
For years I am wondering about the different syntax for
sending/reporting/submitting bug reports.

I know of 


    1. org-submit-bug-report but

       a. org-agenda-property-bug-report 

    2. TeX-submit-bug-report, but

       a. preview-report-bug

       b. reftex-report-bug   


    1. bbdb-submit-bug-report

    2. c-submit-bug-report

    3. ffap-submit-bug

    4. vm-submit-bug-report

    5. gnus-bug

    6. report-emacs-bug

So in order not to confuse myself I am using the following alias 

(defalias 'emacs-submit-bug-report 'report-emacs-bug)

But I was wondering, couldn't GNU emacs also use this alias in its
default configuration, since it seems a bit more common.

And also the auctex team, which deals with preview-latex and reftex do
the same

(defalias 'preview-submit-bug-report 'preview-report-bug)
(defalias 'reftex-submit-bug-report 'reftex-report-bug)        


The org team:

(defalias 'emacs-submit-bug-report 'report-emacs-bug)
(defalias 'org-agenda-property-submit-bug-report 'org-agenda-property-bug-report)

And finally the gnus team


(defalias 'gnus-submit-bug-report 'gnus-bug)

Regards

Uwe Brauer 

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Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Po Lu]

Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes:

> I am sending this email to four mailing list I am using most, and I am

Please don't cross-post in the future.  Generally, you should post to
one list, and only cross-post if instructed to post to some other.

(Other lists intentionally removed.)

> wondering whether this subject has came up in the past.  For years I
> am wondering about the different syntax for sending / reporting /
> submitting bug reports.

WDYM by syntax?  Different projects will usually have different
preferred forms for bug reports submitted to them, if that's what you
mean.

Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Stefan Kangas]

Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes:

> So in order not to confuse myself I am using the following alias
>
> (defalias 'emacs-submit-bug-report 'report-emacs-bug)
>
> But I was wondering, couldn't GNU emacs also use this alias in its
> default configuration, since it seems a bit more common.

It's a small mess, indeed.

However, we have in etc/TODO:

    ** Check for any included packages that define obsolete
bug-reporting commands
    Change them to use report-emacs-bug.

    *** Related functions (do all of them need changing?):
    **** org-submit-bug-report
    **** lm-report-bug
    **** tramp-bug
    **** c-submit-bug-report

I looked into this a little bit two years ago, but then got
side-tracked.  Some of these commands should be kept, from the
discussion at the time.  I'll make sure to remember to update the TODO
with what I gathered in my notes at that time.

Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com>
> Date: Sat, 23 Oct 2021 01:16:58 -0700
> 
> Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes:
> 
> > So in order not to confuse myself I am using the following alias
> >
> > (defalias 'emacs-submit-bug-report 'report-emacs-bug)
> >
> > But I was wondering, couldn't GNU emacs also use this alias in its
> > default configuration, since it seems a bit more common.
> 
> It's a small mess, indeed.
> 
> However, we have in etc/TODO:
> 
>     ** Check for any included packages that define obsolete
> bug-reporting commands
>     Change them to use report-emacs-bug.
> 
>     *** Related functions (do all of them need changing?):
>     **** org-submit-bug-report
>     **** lm-report-bug
>     **** tramp-bug
>     **** c-submit-bug-report
> 
> I looked into this a little bit two years ago, but then got
> side-tracked.  Some of these commands should be kept, from the
> discussion at the time.  I'll make sure to remember to update the TODO
> with what I gathered in my notes at that time.

Can't report-emacs-bug intuit what to do by looking at the current
major mode, and perhaps some other variables?

Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Stefan Kangas]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

>> I looked into this a little bit two years ago, but then got
>> side-tracked.  Some of these commands should be kept, from the
>> discussion at the time.  I'll make sure to remember to update the TODO
>> with what I gathered in my notes at that time.
>
> Can't report-emacs-bug intuit what to do by looking at the current
> major mode, and perhaps some other variables?

I think yes, but the cases where they should be kept is from the
previous discussion only where a package maintainer explicitly sees a
specific need for it or otherwise wants to keep it.

Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Uwe Brauer]

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>>> "PL" == Po Lu <luangruo@yahoo.com> writes:

> Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes:
>> I am sending this email to four mailing list I am using most, and I am

> Please don't cross-post in the future.  Generally, you should post to
> one list, and only cross-post if instructed to post to some other.


Well I know about this rule, and in 99.9% of the cases this is justified.
However recall that 

    1. Reftex

    2. Gnus

    3. Org-mode

Are already in the GNU emacs tree. Auctex may follow suit. 
On top of that reftex is maintained by the auctex maintainers.


> (Other lists intentionally removed.)

>> wondering whether this subject has came up in the past.  For years I
>> am wondering about the different syntax for sending / reporting /
>> submitting bug reports.

> WDYM by syntax?  Different projects will usually have different
> preferred forms for bug reports submitted to them, if that's what you
> mean.

There are two issues here.

    1. Have a common syntax for sending bug reports, for example

       - package-report-bug or

       - package-submit-bug-report

    2. The other, more complex issue, is that within GNU emacs the
       command emacs-report-bug would send an appropriate bug report
       based on the mayor mode used when calling the bug-report function



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Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Po Lu]

Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes:

> There are two issues here.
>
>     1. Have a common syntax for sending bug reports, for example
>
>        - package-report-bug or
>
>        - package-submit-bug-report

What's package-report-bug?  I haven't heard of that command before, and
I can't seem to find it anywhere.

RE: [External] : Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Drew Adams]

> There are two issues here.
>     1. Have a common syntax for sending bug reports, for example
>        - package-report-bug or
>        - package-submit-bug-report
>     2. The other, more complex issue, is that within GNU emacs the
>        command emacs-report-bug would send an appropriate bug report
>        based on the mayor mode used when calling the bug-report
>        function

I don't see the lack of uniqueness as a real problem.
Can you give an example/scenario that points out what
problems might arise from it?  I'm not saying there
are none; I just can't see them yet.

What you show there are descriptions of solutions.
It's the problems they're intended to fix that I have
trouble imagining (so far).
___

[FWIW, for my libraries I use "<libname>-send-bug-report".
In this case the command just invokes `browse-url' with
a `mailto:' that constructs a mail skeleton with Subject
line and some instructions and the emacs-version in the
body.  (Sending an email isn't much in the way of
"submitting" a report.)]

Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Uwe Brauer]

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>>> "PL" == Po Lu <luangruo@yahoo.com> writes:

> Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes:
>> There are two issues here.
>> 
>> 1. Have a common syntax for sending bug reports, for example
>> 
>> - package-report-bug or
>> 
>> - package-submit-bug-report

> What's package-report-bug?  I haven't heard of that command before, and
> I can't seem to find it anywhere.

It was an example, a proposal of how the naming could be, if it were unified. Nothing that exists yet. 

So having 

    - emacs-report-bug

    - TeX-report-bug

    - org-report-bug

Would be easier for the user to remember, the same holds for 

    - emacs-submit-bug-report

    - TeX-submit-bug-report

    - org-submit-bug-report

These are proposals! 


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Re: [External] : Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Uwe Brauer]

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>>> "DA" == Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> There are two issues here.
>> 1. Have a common syntax for sending bug reports, for example
>> - package-report-bug or
>> - package-submit-bug-report
>> 2. The other, more complex issue, is that within GNU emacs the
>> command emacs-report-bug would send an appropriate bug report
>> based on the mayor mode used when calling the bug-report
>> function

> I don't see the lack of uniqueness as a real problem.
> Can you give an example/scenario that points out what
> problems might arise from it?  I'm not saying there
> are none; I just can't see them yet.


> What you show there are descriptions of solutions.
> It's the problems they're intended to fix that I have
> trouble imagining (so far).

May it is just me. When I want to send a bug report, for some
package/library the first thing I do is running the apropos-command and
searching the word bug, to find out the specific syntax. As I said there
is, at least

    - libname-report-bug

    - libname-submit-bug-report

    - libname-send-bug-report (your example)

So that is confusing I say. If one convention would be chosen, like in 
«one ring to rule them all» I think it would simplify things a bit. 
At least that is my experience over the years

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Re: [External] : Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Uwe Brauer]

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   > May it is just me. When I want to send a bug report, for some
   > package/library the first thing I do is running the apropos-command and
   > searching the word bug, to find out the specific syntax. As I said there
   > is, at least

   >     - libname-report-bug

   >     - libname-submit-bug-report

   >     - libname-send-bug-report (your example)

   > So that is confusing I say. If one convention would be chosen, like in 
   > «one ring to rule them all» I think it would simplify things a bit. 
   > At least that is my experience over the years


To emphasise this a bit more: suppose there would also be

    - libname-deliver-bug-report

    - libname-send-by-owl-bug-report

Wouldn't you say, that is a bit too much?

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RE: [External] : Re: unique syntax for reporting (submitting bugs)

[Drew Adams]

> So that is confusing I say. If one convention would be chosen, like in
> «one ring to rule them all» I think it would simplify things a bit.
> At least that is my experience over the years

It's OK by me.  I don't see it as much of a problem.
But it might not hurt to add some suggestion of a
format to (elisp) `Coding Conventions' for it.
___

(OT - Of course, that node could be made clearer
about how much this or that "rule" is a stylistic
suggestion, versus something intended more strongly.
And then there's the question of whether a given
rule is both strict for submission to Emacs itself
and just a suggestion for other 3rd-party code.)