From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Augusto Stoffel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [External] : Re: Simple isearch concerns Date: Tue, 11 May 2021 11:01:47 +0200 Message-ID: <87r1idve2s.fsf@gmail.com> References: <20210403001539.x4rb55dvh46rmhb3.ref@Ergus> <87v98asulc.fsf@gmail.com> <87pmyimiwd.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87bla11u5q.fsf@gmail.com> <87lf937hgk.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87y2d1ksga.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87r1it7zfw.fsf@gmail.com> <87v98466it.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87bl9wcksv.fsf@gmail.com> <87tunnzqci.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87bl9tmzun.fsf@gmail.com> <87y2cwhiti.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87h7jk75b7.fsf@gmail.com> <87k0ofyd4p.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <875yzwq4x7.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <875yzumpur.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87v97tcyx5.fsf@gmail.com> <87k0o7n2kk.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <878s4muwdn.fsf@mail.linkov.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="37264"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) Cc: Philip Kaludercic , Ergus , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" , Gregory Heytings , Manuel Uberti , Juri Linkov , Drew Adams To: Yuri Khan Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue May 11 11:29:13 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lgOhV-0009YT-BA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 11:29:13 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43376 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lgOhU-0006al-CQ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 05:29:12 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44786) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lgOH3-0004bN-0l for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 05:01:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ej1-x636.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::636]:38633) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lgOH1-00026t-7j for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 05:01:52 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-ej1-x636.google.com with SMTP id b25so28596901eju.5 for ; Tue, 11 May 2021 02:01:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:message-id:user-agent :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=CEnXm1bBdUKU1pHdIikO+HjjW4A7Jyzxz2cfWimJgDs=; b=BfRjhcxr91AI5SXaNMUsCkoC4wgzsHxZ/HPkFwtxHij0LsI+CF8Hx5BnIVTb0BML+F AEQiqNngT0Tgmn7Sveq8sZIfipgFiXJa/TRxzqU5zeKsOFehKCMj+DUzDpqpOCbghxM+ 0Xc+JewAXhMdNp0EJCI4xRKL3fIT/YlMWN0TKQKhNSErq+AfEkoGT2hMEAEKXqnII9r5 027QK/pNHKtK702ZIRL6oUH59p84mX7rOW1GMvOfSW0kc+fty08Twav/Csrj9r+vUoyZ KE8MIJsc74L6N8M7apAsm9oiV1uF66KgS/24Asz/ZyjnaUw5EpkkC5L9uy1S6jT2lqfc HZNw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=CEnXm1bBdUKU1pHdIikO+HjjW4A7Jyzxz2cfWimJgDs=; b=AlpYjt02l9NKMw1nb68U5ZVhoCWDE7lJnXBxLvWWVM2C8wLC5svSJBZESdwZrO5Uop UyUQ2775Zu/lTO+nkmd2MH68wmQhePjwr6PF+b29EpZxK0yUXxJjTOGRiBUfUXfk0xY8 G1BY6k6pnvU/9sBDhd4ibZ4CA6kugqbaQZ0t2DISvtURit+xR0CWQPbEC3v1eFTiK8Rg kxnZ8E4p54BjkK4ONgoOfcviXbtWBhSWuaQEwCaFkIKCVvC7Yk5/28goWJHUxBw0okd5 frem5y/vQPkBIIp0T1hW78jSE7OUZWo8npgfXR/TAtkQWRle41d+zY5kwPPMDwvqiAFq 9pYQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531weut8jORoGRLxbbSnPSHz3U9PsHd2H7ZMFdxzpSOlee7DgDlF X8DHvp19XAWk4iporJYq2aA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyRPElLMHpGkkl1Jr0jzS+Qgn/0fF2zVNNF0dP+Az77K4+Ot1CTBWFUVrVLU+xmn8HaPqYd1A== X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:5654:: with SMTP id v20mr30107369ejr.462.1620723709983; Tue, 11 May 2021 02:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from ars3 ([2a02:908:2211:8540::68a]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id k5sm15533822edk.46.2021.05.11.02.01.48 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 11 May 2021 02:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::636; envelope-from=arstoffel@gmail.com; helo=mail-ej1-x636.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:269153 Archived-At: On Tue, 11 May 2021 at 13:20, Yuri Khan wrote: > On Tue, 11 May 2021 at 04:31, Juri Linkov wrote: > >> When you type 'C-f' in a web browser, it activates the "minibuffer". >> Then you can type a search string. As soon as you type a character >> in the minibuffer, it immediately updates the search state >> in the original window. You can edit the search string >> while the minibuffer is active, and the search results are >> updated immediately. Also each browser window has own search. > > That makes sense for a web browser, because a web browser is typically > used only for viewing content and not editing. It typically also has > no point (except in form fields and editable content). (There is also > an optional accessibility feature that gives you a point which you can > move around the page and select text with the keyboard.) > > The typical use case in a browser is to enter a search term and jump > through its occurrences. As soon as you have found the one you want, > you just keep reading from that point. > > Because browsing the Web is mostly a mouse-driven activity, and only a > few keys are involved, a browser can afford giving all text editing > keys to the search bar, including Home/=E2=86=90/=E2=86=92/End to move th= e insertion > point within the search box and any text selection and cut/copy/paste > keys. > > On the other hand, in a text editor such as Emacs, the use case is > different. You want to find an occurrence and then work with buffer > text in its neighborhood, and you want to switch from searching to > editing with as little friction as possible =E2=80=94 preferably none. Is= earch > supports exactly this use case, by making any unbound key terminate > the search and then perform its usual action, and making an exception > for Backspace so you can correct small typing mistakes. This comes at > the price of making editing the search string itself a bit less > convenient =E2=80=94 one has to press M-e for that. The approach Isearch uses to read the search string is fine, but, unlike you seem to be claiming, it has no fundamental advantage over using the minibuffer. In the minibuffer-based Isearch, one could easily make every movement command (or any random subset of them) quit the minibuffer first. In fact, the patch already adds this behavior for `isearch-query-replace' and a few other commands.