From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Updating the "ELPA Protocol" Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2022 15:32:46 +0000 Message-ID: <87r0y2ncdd.fsf@posteo.net> References: <164484721900.31751.1453162457552427931@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <83v8nsyof7.fsf@gnu.org> <87leoond7l.fsf@posteo.net> <83r0yfzz01.fsf@gnu.org> <87bkpjyx3p.fsf@posteo.net> <83bkpjynmj.fsf@gnu.org> <87iljqya44.fsf@posteo.net> <8335auzo9s.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgd2ws8z.fsf@posteo.net> <831qqezkxj.fsf@gnu.org> <87y1slgq3m.fsf@posteo.net> <87bkpgfsqv.fsf@posteo.net> <87educ9fei.fsf@posteo.net> <87y1sk7xtg.fsf_-_@posteo.net> <87h6z0rnuz.fsf@posteo.net> <87mt8r8i7j.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="12365"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Stefan Kangas , Eli Zaretskii , rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org, Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Nov 16 16:33:46 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1ovKQ5-0002yz-Ei for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2022 16:33:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ovKPS-0003FY-MS; Wed, 16 Nov 2022 10:33:06 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ovKPP-0003EN-Bi for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2022 10:33:05 -0500 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ovKPL-0005PP-Mg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2022 10:33:01 -0500 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C82E3240027 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2022 16:32:56 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1668612777; bh=Hap0wzSkpGxFyqnT4Z2o+LududUkkUu5CJSszov6wjo=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=nVmXZqfQpXKhHXGRoDUYo3yJ1QXEKaVYIXBSpxpGwsDQA40UDFgfATuU5npEOIFJk hMxNuXLJ8lu0TqFtRISAOZoBFjZjCPLSpML7kOmJXiX4h+0swoXcXRx6xqgJoKAg++ OW6t4XMUDD539raNrUpho11gqPhkX4THjreh1aSibc8ez/rm3/ioVaAmgfCYYcj8q4 uhSygyW9/UYe9E7TANPLvgyJD4MVm3ng5ddsVPf/c/6QyPvV0UlJJ3DlF8HBL6ur9T vhzkfZzD5/WwNisMSBP7v2FT0Qs261xj95kuA6ITgPqwgBvNJPrhHTt2+STN5ry7EQ OxNgiLNeS/LJA== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4NC6WC61v9z6tqB; Wed, 16 Nov 2022 16:32:55 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Wed, 16 Nov 2022 10:07:08 -0500") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:299939 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >>>> One issue I have been told is the issue of renaming a package, so that >>>> package.el can transparently handle the rename. That appears to not be >>>> supported. > > I think we'd need more details and concrete examples to judge how best > handle such renamings. The problem I see is that in Emacs, names are > very visible: the package name almost inevitably affect the ELisp > files's names, which themselves affect the functions and vars defined > therein. > > For that reason handling the renaming only in ELPA is rarely sufficient. > And also for that reason, renamings are rare. >From what I know this happens from time to time on MELPA. The changes usually have to be backwards-compatible or the renames must be trivial (a change like "foo" -> "foo-mode" or vice versa). >>> How about using something like Debian's transitional packages, where you >>> replace the old package with an empty package that just depends on the >>> new package? Would that work? >> It might, but then the user is required to remove the old package and >> select the new one, right? > > Compared to all the adjustments they may need to do do their config, > I suspect this is rather minor (and as the other Stefan mentions, it's > not indispensable). True, but I can imagine it causing confusion, when you find the actually selected package being empty and the real package listed as a "mere" dependency.