From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: New Package for NonGNU-ELPA: clojure-ts-mode Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2023 13:16:54 +0000 Message-ID: <87r0noiq0p.fsf@posteo.net> References: <87il9kksqz.fsf@dfreeman.email> <87a5uw9ivs.fsf@posteo.net> <87ttt42gna.fsf@dfreeman.email> <87wmy080kn.fsf@posteo.net> <83v8djcydl.fsf@gnu.org> <87350ndquw.fsf@dfreeman.email> <83350ncbns.fsf@gnu.org> <87cyzrjbd8.fsf@dfreeman.email> <83zg2vav46.fsf@gnu.org> <87o7j99304.fsf@dfreeman.email> <87wmxj27fn.fsf@dfreeman.email> <831qfrptiq.fsf@gnu.org> <57429221-d9be-5791-e975-b3539905e2f6@gutov.dev> <83a5udlj47.fsf@gnu.org> <87a5udk1co.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4753"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Dmitry Gutov , Danny Freeman , Stefan Kangas , emacs-devel , Manuel Uberti To: =?utf-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Aug 27 15:18:06 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qaFeY-000117-AU for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 27 Aug 2023 15:18:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qaFdi-0005LB-Ep; Sun, 27 Aug 2023 09:17:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qaFdc-0005Fz-PM for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 27 Aug 2023 09:17:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qaFdZ-0000w0-CR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 27 Aug 2023 09:17:08 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 40F5924010C for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2023 15:17:03 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1693142223; bh=3TkKV24LJhcc7XxP4RY+1XVWD/iPmMWHNJOC2dcGbMQ=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Autocrypt:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Transfer-Encoding:From; b=bKbXcLIxUxNLD0o60GasXlQrvcbZkWPXRDAPQOHnaC7YUHsNG6BjViTSkpdNNLzBm POps3Oz2p+1vkjW1arNmJWq7UbPRPVQH77eyRq8FeBcldq7RRKxEuxQEvnKNeys2KB Dc9c/j+Dh/XYP06j9fTqckxYKPV3LHHXsBkyhPZez9bnIne4neXvgJZX1POdOvu9e5 bZleYO2yoCHSD6YqZO6NHwOEnX+A0pIaTvhgrUmihNH9btq5bEaS1zdfj5LrZnxztW jyFO+RNl9usLE7fkAPP6o+xoMriYNKpReqk6O83V9e9wpTAz7zRrDiOcRavRn4QpmL AVH+02670A/yw== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4RYZ3B5xM3z6vFB; Sun, 27 Aug 2023 15:16:54 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: (=?utf-8?Q?=22Jo=C3=A3o_T=C3=A1vora=22's?= message of "Sun, 27 Aug 2023 07:26:55 +0100") Autocrypt: addr=philipk@posteo.net; keydata= mDMEZBBQQhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAHJuofBrfqFh12uQu0Yi7mrl525F28eTmwUDflFNmdui0QlBo aWxpcCBLYWx1ZGVyY2ljIChnZW5lcmF0ZWQgYnkgYXV0b2NyeXB0LmVsKSA8cGhpbGlwa0Bwb3N0 ZW8ubmV0PoiWBBMWCAA+FiEEDg7HY17ghYlni8XN8xYDWXahwukFAmQQUEICGwMFCQHhM4AFCwkI BwIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQ8xYDWXahwulikAEA77hloUiSrXgFkUVJhlKBpLCHUjA0 mWZ9j9w5d08+jVwBAK6c4iGP7j+/PhbkxaEKa4V3MzIl7zJkcNNjHCXmvFcEuDgEZBBQQhIKKwYB BAGXVQEFAQEHQI5NLiLRjZy3OfSt1dhCmFyn+fN/QKELUYQetiaoe+MMAwEIB4h+BBgWCAAmFiEE Dg7HY17ghYlni8XN8xYDWXahwukFAmQQUEICGwwFCQHhM4AACgkQ8xYDWXahwukm+wEA8cml4JpK NeAu65rg+auKrPOP6TP/4YWRCTIvuYDm0joBALw98AMz7/qMHvSCeU/hw9PL6u6R2EScxtpKnWof z4oM Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -53 X-Spam_score: -5.4 X-Spam_bar: ----- X-Spam_report: (-5.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=-1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:309333 Archived-At: Jo=C3=A3o T=C3=A1vora writes: > On Sat, Aug 26, 2023, 21:15 Philip Kaludercic wrote: > >> Eli Zaretskii writes: >> >> >> Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2023 21:52:31 +0300 >> >> Cc: stefankangas@gmail.com, philipk@posteo.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org, >> >> manuel.uberti@inventati.org >> >> From: Dmitry Gutov >> >> >> >> On 25/08/2023 08:42, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> >> > IME, the development model of Emacs is an important reason why Emacs >> >> > is still alive and kicking almost 40 years since it was first >> >> > developed. And important major modes in Emacs are alive and kicking >> >> > with it. So inclusion in Emacs and the pains of adjusting to a >> >> > different development model are justified if one wants the major mo= de >> >> > to remain alive for many years to come. Something to think about, I >> >> > guess. >> >> >> >> Or the longevity stems from other reasons (e.g. good fundamental idea= s, >> >> unique proposition, being part of the original GNU system, ...), and >> the >> >> development process is the reason the current user base is a fraction >> of >> >> even Vim's (not to mention popular commercial offerings). >> >> >> >> Just an alternative POV to consider. In truth, could be a little of >> both. >> > >> > Mine wasn't a POV, it was an observation based on many years of >> > watching the development and being part of it. >> >> Correct me if I am wrong: This seems to be related to the fact that the >> GitHub-model (thought it probably precedes it) of development has >> motivated more and more individuals to maintain packages, instead of >> organisations like GNU, Apache, etc. Or at least I understand that if >> there is a collective effort behind maintaining the components of a >> system, contributors can come and go without a package being abandoned >> -- this is especially true for Emacs due to the extensive >> introspectability. But it appears this reaches a limit, if a component >> is too complex (CEDET was mentioned as one example, and if Jo=C3=A3o wer= e to >> suddenly loose interest in contributing to Emacs, something similar >> might happen to Eglot as well). > [...] > I'm a bit perplexed why you picked me as the star of "what if > he were to disappear?" but I guess I'm as good a candidate as > Michael, Lars, Dmitry or so many others. Mainly because I am under the impression that of all the contributors to Eglot, you have the best understanding of LSP as a protocol. But you are right, it was mostly the first example that came to mind when comparing it to CEDET.